Hey bdaddy, Javon had one good year and wanted more money. Brett had 14 Hall of Fame years and wants to win. Is that your argument? TO destroyed the Eagles team having fights the weight room with Trotter. He's dancing on the Dallas star for self recognition, and he wanted more money too. Brett wants to win. You can't compare him with Favre because of a comment. Plus Brett is just stating the obvious. What are they going to do? Cut him?
I think "Selfish" is the wrong word. Favre at least has to use some common sense, or at least some sense of obligation to understand the team needs to move ahead. They have a young, inexperienced QB that needs to prepare for leading an NFL team in the aftermath of Favre's storied career. That's more pressure than can be heaped on him come July. The real fact of the matter is, though, that the Packers are in rebuilding mode. If Favre comes back, what's the outcome? A few good stat games, many interceptions, and, if lucky, a .500 record? His taking so long to make a decision leads me to believe he really doesn't have that burning desire to play anymore, and he should hang 'em up. I, personally, am sick of him holding the entire organization hostage waiting for his decision. The things I admire about pro athletes comprise a list that gets shorter and shorter daily, but I respect those who know when to exit, make their decision, and stick by it. Whether it's Jim Kelly, Barry Sanders, whoever. Quit acting like the entire world revolves around you, Brett, and realize the Packers will go on. As for Chmura, any reporter, radio, whatever, that would be dumb enough to elicit a quote from him should look for another line of work. He has a putrid reputation and zero credibility. He was, however, a great tight end and producer for Favre for years, and Brett probably could have offered him a bit of support during his problems. This doesn't mean he'd have to invite the guy to live in his guest room.
Favre played his entire career with minimal talent coming in. He took noname receivers and made them pro-bowlers. The last big-name receiver he had was Sterling Sharpe and that was in his first couple of years. He took guys with no identity and made them something. I honestly do not understand why the Packers never drafted a bigtime receiver - I guess they did not want the expense. They passed on several and the one I really wanted for Favre was Santana Moss. Favre has never had a receiver with blazing speed or super size but year in and year out he makes it work and ususally leads the league in yards. This probably leads to alot of the interceptions - he never has the talent to get open and overpower the defense. So try another angle because he has never had talent going in but by the end of the season some of these guys have a name.
If player A makes more than $8.5 million for a year and player B makes less than $400,000 for that same year, player A should not call player B selfish for wanting more money. Javon didn't have one good year, he had a breakout year. And, Favre called him out without ever talking to him. Walker did not hold out and he hadn't missed any required time at that point. So, I don't know how Favre's preemptive move is at all defensible.
I think we should make two distinctions: 1) Chmura is a dick for saying this. 2) Favre is done (and is therefore fucking up his team by hanging around when he's clearly not anywhere near as good as he once was). Fair enough?
There is a long way to go before the mess that is the Packers is cleaned up. Chmura at his trial came across as a sleazeball and I can't believe anyone would consider letting him host a talk show unless it was broadcast inside the Wisconsin State Peniteniary walls. As much as I have enjoyed Favre's career exploits, I thought he really looked pretty damn bad last year, "inferior" teammates not withstanding. And leaving your teammates to ponder all off-season whether or not you plan to return is damn sure not showing committment to your teammates, fans, or the organization. Shit or get off the pot, Brett.
Hi i'm Mark Chmura, I like having sex with teens. Brett's not my friend any more. I don't care about his wife's breast cancer, or his father's and brother-in-law's death. And I really don't care about his home town being blown away. He never called me. I was hoping to hook up with one of his daughters. Yes i know, i have an imature mind of a high schooler. Boo-hoo Where's my binky it's time for my nap. Grow up Mark, or go back in your hole.
Yes, Favre is on the downside of his career if he does play, but I would rather watch him at this point of his career than some young talent with half the heart (nothing against Aaron Rodgers because we luckily do not know him yet) or some quarterback that thinks they are a running back because they can't pass. By the way - the "thought to be new era quarterback with all the scrambling and running skills" has still yet to win a Superbowl. He will not do it - but Favre could go to a handfull of teams I can think of and turn them into a Superbowl contender. He is definately not looking for that type of project, but his "depleted skills" are still good enough for it. Face it - we have players that do this in every sport. I wish I would have been lucky enough to be faced with such a difficult decision as these athletes face at the end of a career. I don't believe much respect is lost until you try to come back like Deion Sanders, Michael Jordan, etc. I don't hear this debate over Roger Clemens and he does it every year - with the difference being he will pimp himself to any willing team with the big bucks.
But since it's farve they treat it like "oh, that's just Favre being Favre". They've been doing that with Favre his whole career. Comment icon posted by bdaddy at 6:48 AM CST on April 4 They've been doing that with Favre his whole career. But(so) since it's farve they treat it like "oh, that's just Favre being Favre". There that sounds a bit more logical. If the packers have treated him like this from day one why would you expect them to change now. I do agree though that Brett should have made his decision by now. Not that he is holding the team back, but he IS holding packer fans hostage (so to speak) by dragging this decision out so long.
Do some of the people in this thread know more than the lawyers, judge, and jury that were involved in trying chmura? if not I feel like people should stop alluding to the idea that Chmura was guilty; for some reason that bugs the shit out of me.
Enough information was out there to know that something is wrong with the man. Mature adults do not playing drinking games with kids at high school prom parties.
Chmura got a sympathetic jury, the details of what he did admit to are enough to brand him as some one I would not want my children around , and I personally thought his accuser was far more credible than he. Trying a Packer up there is akin to trying Goebbels in Berlin.
makes sense I guess.
Holy Cow!! More Packer homers here than I've seen in a long time. Brett should make up his mind and stop holding the Pack hostage. B.F. knows if he will play this upcoming year already I'm sure, stop the drama already. Mark Chmura is not even worth commenting on.
You beat me to it stockman. You pretty much said what I was going to say.
Check out the Bonds thread. Now there is someone that should retire instead of suffer redicule for the remainder of his career. He's still playing to corruptly break some records while Favre could care less about any records. I think Favre should come back and make his own decision to sit out a few starts as Cal Jr. did and show the changing of the guard in Green Bay. I hate to see it but it has to happen - soon. He will always be the greatest in my book regardless of how he retires but that would be ending a great career with class. My money is on Favre eventually starting his own Nascar team - maybe he can team up with Bradshaw. Maybe they could call it Hall of Fame Racing - no -wait -that ones already taken.
We have enough Bonds threads. Please don't turn this one into one as well.
Bonds? Who's that? Never heard of him. I'm not listening!!! LaLaLaLaLaLaLaLaLaLaLa
Is this guy serious! Selfish? Hey Chmura, how many players on the team did you call to say you were sorry about embarrasing the entire team with your underage girl chasing, huh, what does your wife and kids have to say about that. Go chase yourself. If your not tring to throw him under the bus, what are you trying to do. Better take another look at his stats before you go calling him selfish. He hasn't sat out a game since you were in college. I'm not even a Packer fan, but 15 years, 8 probowls, 6 Packer team records, 3 MVP's and 2 superbowls. Yeah, pretty selfish. Things must be slow at the radio station.
This is such a non-story it's remarkable we're talking about it. Chmura, who does not play for the Packers and knows nothing about the situation, calls Favre some names because Favre didn't want to talk to him while he was on trial for raping his babysitter. This is barely more credible than if I called up Wisconsin radio and explained why I thought Bubba Franks was probably a child molester.
Being innocent in a court of law doesn't mean you should get a free pass with the rest of the world. Chmura's conduct that evening was ridiculous. He was a 30-year-old man. Getting drunk and partying in a hot tub with a bunch of kids after prom? How can the Packer fans still embrace this creep?
Chmura is just trying to bring Farve down with his ship. Meanwhile Farve is trying to keep his ship from sinking. Does someone have a couple of Anchors?
farve has every right to be selfish,like none of you guys are.he's given that organization everything,they should do the same .and about that child molester.what can you say to that guy.hey,little girl want a piece of candy?chumra needs casterated.
What the hell gives someone the right to be selfish? And you may not be aware of this, but the Packers actually paid Favre to play for them! That's right -- he's played in a whole bunch of games in a row, but he also was being monetarily compensated to be in them! Of course, he might have helped Green Bay more by not being in some of them, but that's not important, is it?
I think we should make two distinctions: 1) Chmura is a dick for saying this. 2) Favre is done (and is therefore fucking up his team by hanging around when he's clearly not anywhere near as good as he once was). Fair enough? Could agree more. Chmura is an ass, but Farve is hanging on too long and is hurting the Packers because of it. Time for him to go gently into that good night.
Unless of course he wants to come to Detriot and play? We just got rid of a washed up has-been QB (and another one that never-was) and management is always willing to pay for another that won't do us any good.
I have felt the same way as the Favre nay-sayers in the past. I hated Troy Aikman because I hated the cowboys. I hated them for their success and their ability to beat the Packers every year on THEIR turf. Aikman could not have retired early enough for me. Now all hatred aside, if not for the medical reasons, I still think Troy could play today and would I want him on my team - Hell yeah! Put the silver stars aside and he was a stand-up guy that showed alot of class even though he had a criminal supporting cast. Favre is pretty much in the same boat, especially to the division rivals. Would you take him to quarterback your team this season? I know the Bears need him, Lions - absolutely, Vikings - couldn't pass that up, as well as a dozen other teams in the league with subpar quarterbacks. And back to Chmura - you were nothing without Favre and you went and ruined it as well as knocked a dent in the team. Favre did the right thing by letting it go. Was he supposed to put himself in the media as being a sex-crime supporter - which is exactly what the media would have done. Just because you are not found guilty in our court system does not mean you are not guilty to the general public. Yeah, you to OJ.
I know the Bears need him, Lions - absolutely, Vikings - couldn't pass that up, as well as a dozen other teams in the league with subpar quarterbacks. As a Lions fan I'd say absolutely NOT! He's getting too old and he'd cost a lot more then he's worth. I'd rather have Harrington back then a washed up Favre.
Would you take him to quarterback your team this season? I know the Bears need him, Lions - absolutely, Vikings - couldn't pass that up, as well as a dozen other teams in the league with subpar quarterbacks. I seriously doubt there would be many takers. Favre makes a lot of money and has a cap number over $12 million. That is around Manning and higher than Brady.
Well, supposedly the Jets are under by $14 million. Bring him on over. He couldn't possibly do worse than Vinny, right? And with thier front line it might not take to long for an injury to force BF to retire.
Umm, no way do the Jets want to get somebody old in there who will expect to start. I imagine the Redskins would find a way to get Favre. They apparently do not have the cap that they other teams have since they continually sign FAs to big contracts.
Umm, no way do the Jets want to get somebody old in there who will expect to start. You are absolutely right, bperk. But I was just being sarcastic. Sorry for the confusion. What the Jets really need, oh nevermind, this isn't about the Jets. But if Brett didn't jump on board before the first roster bonus signing date, I can't say he is completely selfish. Yes, he does need to make a decision so the Packers would know what they need to do. At the very least I would like to see him come back in a mentor role for a young QB.
At the very least I would like to see him come back in a mentor role for a young QB. Last season, Favre said it wasn't in his contract to teach Rodgers how to be an NFL QB. I doubt that he will take on a mentoring role.
Did he really? Wow, what a jerk. If that is his attitude, and he hasn't made a decision, I would say forget him. Other teams are signing and trading so Green Bay needs to do something besides play a waiting game.
After the seasons that Favre has produced as a packer he's earned the right to be a little maybe even a lot selfish. He has every right to think everything through even up till opening day. It's his career that will be tarnished if he comes back and his butt on the line if he doesn't produce. Do you think that he wants another season like last? As a die hard packer fan I and most that i talk to want him back. I'm truly convinced that aaron rodgers needs atleast another year and Brett deserves one more. Mark Chmura and him were friends they even got a tattoo of the superman symbol together. But that still doesn't mean that If chmura does something wrong that Favre has to remain friends with him. Maybe before he supported him he waited for the evidence to come out and what he saw he was disgusted with. Mark's just jealous that Brett has career decsions to make since Mark hasn't had career in a long time. He wants Brett to go out looking like an ass like he did but that's not going to happen so he's doing anything to ruin favre's reputation.
Favre can be summed up in two words: Midlife Crisis. Yeah, I get irritated because he keeps putting off the inevitable, but I do feel for the guy. I think that his head tells him he's done, but his heart tells him to stay. This is all that he knows.
Last season, Favre said it wasn't in his contract to teach Rodgers how to be an NFL QB. I doubt that he will take on a mentoring role. Well that's one side of that story, Rodgers would disagree: In a recent ESPN interview, Favre said he wasnt being paid to coach-- and that its not in his contract to teach-- Rodgers. As a result of those comments, Favre has received criticism from the national media for a perceived unwillingness to help the player who could be the Packers quarterback of the future. I heard about it from a couple different people, and I saw one thing where someone called him a hypocrite,-- Rodgers said. Its ludicrous and its a disservice to Brett.-- Rodgers said any criticism of Favre is unwarranted. Im probably offended as much as he is by the stuff I see in the media about him,-- Rodgers said. Not only is he one of the greatest quarterbacks of all time, but hes an awesome teammate.-- From here
he could turn lake water into Schlitz (admittedly not a huge change, rofl call TO whatever you want but a liar hes not. mark, probably isnt either.
tron7, that's an interesting quote. Rodgers publicly has his teammate's back, though the actual accusations (selfishness, unwillingness to properly mentor his successor) are completely ignored. Which tells me they may have some truth to them. Those sound like the words of someone who may be pissed at Brett for leaving him out to twist in the wind, but isn't willing to take that beef public. +1 to Aaron Rodgers.
call TO whatever you want but a liar hes not. mark, probably isnt either. Might I ask you to connect the 4 million dots between those two trenchant points?
Hey here is the bottom line. Favre has a family. Thats what is most important to him. Next like "justgary" said Favre has two daughters that does have something to do with it. I mean OJ was aquitted but how many people still talk about the murders that he was aquitted of and still do not like him or want to be around him. Would you want your little girls around Mark Chmura. I know I would not even if he has been aquitted of his crime. I personally was shocked when I heard about Mark Chmura being charged, but now that I have a daughter of my own. I think alot differently about things. To go on further Chmura is upset so who does he blame it on the Packers star player. Sort of like how Jose Consaco was drilling Mark Mc Guire about steriods. Its all media hype. Then the deal with Favre not being a team player. Well if he was not good enough to start then Rodgers would have started like Eli Manning did over Kurt Warner. Then you can look at his work ethic and state that this guy plays hurt, sick, after family tragdy. I mean what else could you ask out of somebody. Man what a guy Brett Favre is!!!
Jose Conseco had sex with Madonna...Madonna is from Bay City, Michigan...Bay City and other Northern Michigan cities and towns root for Green Bay over the Lions...Favre plays for Green Bay...So there is your Barry Bonds steroid connection! P.S. Kevin Bacon told me this...
Dont get me wrong i love Brett Favre, we have the same b-day and everything. But he is being selfish by not making a decision. Javon Walker got ripped by media and Brett. Im sorry but as an athlete i can take criticism from coaches,press, and fans, but having ur QB who u take passes from rip on u is not cool. No one has the Balls to step up to Favre cuz if they do he might leave. And he causing the Packers to miss out on some good free agents b/c he's waiting. To get Favre the winning team he wants, he needs to give them an answer soon, so they can stop worrying and waiting on his decision. THe longer he takes the longer good free agents get passed up. I mean lets face it Ted Thompson and the head office arent the brightest of the bunch. Im glad someone finally put Favre out there, even if it was Chumura. Yea what he did was stupid and i would hesistate to have my daughters around him, but Favre and him were good buddies. We all have friends that do stupid shit, some way stupid shit than others, but has a friend it's still our job to talk to them. Favre couldve at least called and if he didnt want Chumura to be around his daughters he couldve said it.He at least deserved that, they were hunting buddies for cryin out loud, they probably bonded more than anyone on the team. (Not BrokeBack Mountain bonding, but u know what i mean) I agree with the other comments in if TO wouldve said what Favre said media wouldve been all over him.I love Favre want him to come back, he makes football looks fun, like when we were all kids playin in the street. Favre probably is selfish, but that comes with the package of being one of the best QB's ever. He's probably more cocky than selfish, but hey all athletes have their flaw, after all there only human.
tron7, that's an interesting quote. Rodgers publicly has his teammate's back, though the actual accusations (selfishness, unwillingness to properly mentor his successor) are completely ignored. Which tells me they may have some truth to them. Sorry chico, I didn't include this part of the quote: Hes helped me out whenever Ive had questions. Hes answered every question from me,-- Rodgers said. Hes been above and beyond what I expected from him.-- I remember seeing the interview with Rodgers who was pretty adament about Favre being great/helpful/blah blah blah.
In Favre's interview, he was pretty adamant about not taking on that role. From your link: In a recent ESPN interview, Favre said he wasnt being paid to coach-- and that its not in his contract to teach-- Rodgers. I thought it was tacky, but I think Rodgers did a very good spin job on it so as not to have any criticism of Favre out there.
Are there any players out there that it says they have to teach in thier contract? For some reason I don't think so, but I could easily be wrong. I haven't had a job yet where it said that in my job description, but it's something you do for the benefit of the "team". And if you don't want to burn a bridge you put in your two weeks notice and train a replacement. Now if Brett said something like, "I'm not a good teacher, that's not something I can do" then I could cut him some slack. But if he said, he wasnt being paid to coach-- and that its not in his contract to teach-- then that makes him a jerk with an attitude problem in my book.
Well here's the situation: Rodgers gets drafted after there's all kinds of speculation that Favre will retire. Favre gets to training camp and every question is about grooming the next packer quaterback. I think Favre was trying to say "Hey I'm still here. What is in my contract is to get myself ready and to help my team win games." I think Favre tends to be a bit too blunt when the media asks questions that annoy him: Rodgers, Javon Walker situation, retirement.
That's fine, tron, but that is not one of the team-first responses. The team-first response is that I will do whatever it takes to help the team win, including helping Rodgers be the best player that he can be. There is a very good chance that he is not a team-first kind of guy because these things are never revealed until what is best for the team diverges from what is best for Favre. The Rodgers thing and the retirement thing may be the first time that it has really happened.
What I'm saying is I think it was an angry response to questions concerning the future and rebuilding and not the "can this team win a superbowl" questions. I don't think he's handling this retirement situation very well but I'm not ready to proclaim him selfish because he can't decide whether or not to keep playing. Is there a harder decision than that in an athlete's career?
I think Favre leting the Packers hang like that is a selfish move. They need an yes or no answer! What is so hard about it? The Packers need just go ahead as if Favre has said no... They are going to need a replacement anyhow!
