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SportsFilter: The Saturday Huddle

Former NY Knickerbocker, Anthony Mason, dead at 48.

posted by NoMich at 09:31 AM on February 28

SportsFilter: The Friday Huddle

Just watched the highlights. Oh. My. God. Too bad the World Cup is half way around the world. I'm able to watch a few overs before needing to go to bed.

posted by NoMich at 08:59 AM on February 28

SportsFilter: The Friday Huddle

Absolutely ludicrous game of cricket going on at Eden Park, Auckland right now.

posted by owlhouse at 01:35 AM on February 28

SportsFilter: The Friday Huddle

Bill O'Reilly nearly got run over trying to stop the car thief as he was driving out of the hotel parking lot.

posted by beaverboard at 02:03 PM on February 27

SportsFilter: The Friday Huddle

I was very confused as to why he had left the car in a hotel parking lot until ESPN finally managed to allude to it being in a trailer in the fifth paragraph.

posted by Etrigan at 02:02 PM on February 27

SportsFilter: The Friday Huddle

"He estimated the overall value of all vehicles -- including the $250,000 race car, engine, parts, etc. -- was between $350,000 and $400,000."

"Dang.... I'm wishing we had LoJack or something on it!" - maybe that's something to look into when you have a quarter million dollars of car?

posted by yerfatma at 01:46 PM on February 27

SportsFilter: The Friday Huddle

Police in the Atlanta area are looking for a stolen vehicle. Specifically, Travis Kvapil's #44 Sprint Cup racer.

posted by Ufez Jones at 12:06 PM on February 27

SportsFilter: The Friday Huddle

Earl Lloyd, who became the first African-American to play in an NBA game on the night of Halloween, 1950, passed away yesterday at the age of 86.

posted by Ufez Jones at 11:00 AM on February 27

SportsFilter: The Friday Huddle

So glad these pieces are being done about McCoy, and that McPherson referenced Dan Barry. Barry's stadium article was linked prominently in the NYT yesterday and also worth reading (if the NYT paywall will cooperate).

posted by beaverboard at 10:09 AM on February 27

SportsFilter: The Friday Huddle

PawSox legends reminisce about life at McCoy Stadium.

Even that, the most unique feature McCoy Stadium offers, was portrayed this week by one of the new principal owners as a drawback rather than a virtue . . . The same goes for the plentiful and free parking that always has been available at McCoy Stadium.

posted by yerfatma at 09:54 AM on February 27

SportsFilter: The Thursday Huddle

Man, what happened to Clarkson? I know the Leafs grossly overpaid for him, but he was a pretty damn good player for a couple of years in Jersey. It must be true what they say about how tough it is to play in Toronto.

posted by tahoemoj at 08:17 PM on February 26

SportsFilter: The Thursday Huddle

David Clarkson was traded for Nathan Horton, who because he's on long-term injury, doesn't count against the cap. Say what you want about Nonis, but he deserves at least a brief cap tip for getting out from under that deal.

posted by dfleming at 07:55 PM on February 26

SportsFilter: The Thursday Huddle

Maple Leafs trade David Clarkson to Blue Jackets for Nathan Horton

posted by tommytrump at 07:52 PM on February 26

College Player Scores 30 Points in Final 4.5 Minutes

Fun footage to watch, with the best part being that Bill Raftery wasn't there to call the action.

If he had been courtside when Rathan-Mayes hit the banked three while getting fouled, Raftery would have generated an indoor weather event.

posted by beaverboard at 02:47 PM on February 26

SportsFilter: The Tuesday Huddle

Has Tony the Tiger always worn underwear?!

Perhaps Tony slapped some underwear on to appease Mrs. Tiger during the great Tiger infidelities of 2009.

posted by dfleming at 12:23 PM on February 26

SportsFilter: The Wednesday Huddle

"Mr. Bryant, please proceed to the Sporting Goods department. Mr. Bryant to Sporting Goods."

posted by beaverboard at 11:56 AM on February 26

SportsFilter: The Wednesday Huddle

Hard to imagine how it could be 5 times worse ...

Punching a woman in the face while not talking to the press.

posted by grum@work at 11:45 AM on February 26

SportsFilter: The Tuesday Huddle

Tony lost a bet with Michael Phelps at a bong and cheeseburger party.

posted by beaverboard at 11:22 AM on February 26

SportsFilter: The Wednesday Huddle

Hard to imagine how it could be 5 times worse ...

Punching a woman in the face while wearing NFL-prohibited gloves.

posted by rcade at 11:20 AM on February 26

SportsFilter: The Tuesday Huddle

Has Tony the Tiger always worn underwear?!

posted by tahoemoj at 11:05 AM on February 26

SportsFilter: The Wednesday Huddle

The top speculative reason is that he used cocaine a few months back, voluntarily admitted it to MLB, and is expecting to be punished for it (as he's a multiple-time offender when he was in the minors).

I kinda wonder how MLB classifies his suspensions. The final test that he failed in '03 (which was not the first) was during spring training, and it was not inconceivable that he made that Rays team. He also had the incident in 2009 where it seems his inability to actually get any cocaine one night while drunk was the only thing stopping him from failing a test.

I mean - on the one hand, non-PED drug and alcohol suspensions are draconian - but on the other, Hamilton's voluntarily admitted three times in the last five years to incidents and has had to hold press conferences to apologize to the fans. At what point does him coming forward stop being a good sign, worthy of consideration during discussions of his punishment?

posted by dfleming at 08:55 AM on February 26

SportsFilter: The Tuesday Huddle

I've run into a few "NFL concept helmet" stories in the past couple weeks and my reaction to both has been "if you touch the Bengals helmet, I will cut you."

posted by dfleming at 07:31 AM on February 26

SportsFilter: The Wednesday Huddle

Punching a small girl in the face?

Oh...that's bad? Wait, you're Canadian. That's probably bad up there.

posted by NoMich at 09:41 PM on February 25

SportsFilter: The Wednesday Huddle

More rumours about athletes getting in trouble, Josh Hamilton has flown to NY to have a disciplinary hearing with MLB.

The top speculative reason is that he used cocaine a few months back, voluntarily admitted it to MLB, and is expecting to be punished for it (as he's a multiple-time offender when he was in the minors). However, because he voluntarily came forward, the belief is that he'll be treated as a first-time offender by MLB (minimal suspension, if any). It does seem that MLB can bring down an 80-game suspension on him, or even longer (as there was speculation that he was under some previous special agreement with MLB because of his earlier drug history, and there might not be any wiggle room).

In summary, Hamilton probably did cocaine, admitted it, and will either get a small suspension or miss most of the season.

(All we do know is that it definitely isn't PEDs.)

posted by grum@work at 09:16 PM on February 25

SportsFilter: The Wednesday Huddle

Hard to imagine how it could be 5 times worse that the Ray Rice hit without someone ending up in a full length file drawer at the morgue.

Punching 5 women in a row?

Punching a small girl in the face?

posted by grum@work at 09:09 PM on February 25

SportsFilter: The Tuesday Huddle

"helmets all the way down"

I've run into a few "NFL concept helmet" stories in the past couple weeks and my reaction to both has been "if you touch the Bengals helmet, I will cut you."

I actually didn't mind what they did with the background idea here :

The guy who did this series of concepts should probably stop.

posted by Mr Bismarck at 09:02 PM on February 25

SportsFilter: The Wednesday Huddle

Hard to imagine how it could be 5 times worse that the Ray Rice hit without someone ending up in a full length file drawer at the morgue.

posted by beaverboard at 07:06 PM on February 25

Revealed: the ghost game bet on around the world ... that never actually took place.

My grandfather went to yeshiva in Slutzk. No, he was not a midfielder.

posted by hexagram at 05:17 PM on February 25

SportsFilter: The Wednesday Huddle

More info on Bryant - apparently, whoever has it has offered it to TMZ or Bryant's team, depending on who pays more.

Allegedly screen shots have been sent around to some folks in the media attempting to shake them down too. Hell of a way to get a payday.

Roger Goodell is viciously booking a trip to Antarctica as we speak.

posted by dfleming at 04:27 PM on February 25

SportsFilter: The Wednesday Huddle

How's this for a lede? "Early Monday, the Yankees found out Yoan Moncada wasn't coming to their minor league complex and Alex Rodriguez was."

If it's not passed the sniff test of the newsroom, it's not yet a story.

The "People Yelling at Each Other" side of ESPN won a long time ago. Anything they feel like talking about is a story. And if it's too risky, then they let ESPN Radio create a groundswell and report on the controversy.

posted by yerfatma at 04:25 PM on February 25

SportsFilter: The Wednesday Huddle

This has got to be the cagiest semi-leak ever - apparently there is a Dez Bryant video of some kind, showing him doing "something he shouldn't be doing" - but can't possibly be smoking pot or something that simple, because Adam Schefter has been working on it for a long time and there's "a lot involved" and may or may not ever be able to release anything. A source says there's some rumours it's "five times worse than the Ray Rice video."

I've gotta say, this feels insanely irresponsible to me as far as my take on media ethics is concerned. If it's not passed the sniff test of the newsroom, it's not yet a story. In the meantime, it's going to do a heck of a lot to Bryant's negotiations for his largest contract ever to have this come out right now with no actual substance.

Report on facts and stories, not on the media. This kind of hyping of things to come to me is bullshit.

posted by dfleming at 04:15 PM on February 25

SportsFilter: The Tuesday Huddle

Two fonts, one which is horrific

This seems to be an attempt to create brand synergy with Buffalo Wild Wings.

posted by yerfatma at 03:27 PM on February 25

SportsFilter: The Tuesday Huddle

Think of how earth shattering even the first Cincy helmet was to Browns fans, with the understated "Bengals" logo. People in Cleveland must have thought Paul Brown had spent a week in Vegas with showgirls and substances to be able to come up with a departure that bold and imaginative.

The switch to the Bengal stripes motif must have driven Clevelanders to utter manic disorientation. There's a reason God put the city by the side of a lake instead of a river. Fewer bridges for people to jump off of.

The old Dawg Pound logo is far superior to the new one. By several orders of dawgnitude. They went from "Where is that Michael Vick motherfucker?" to "First they cut my balls off when I was asleep, now I need a root canal".

This much must be said: in the good old days, the Browns played in Municipal Stadium and wore all white at home. The weather was almost always terrible, and the grass field was almost always a mess. When you looked at Jim Brown or Leroy Kelly with their offensive linemen at the end of a game played in those conditions, you were looking at some truly bad ass old fashioned hard working football players. You could not read the numbers on their uniforms. What a vision of manly grit and endurance it was. I think the helmets were originally painted orange so Search and Rescue could locate players if a blizzard blew in off the lake.

posted by beaverboard at 03:07 PM on February 25

SportsFilter: The Tuesday Huddle

Two fonts, one which is horrific

The capital B was designed to look like a pregnant woman's torso, then?

posted by tahoemoj at 02:49 PM on February 25

SportsFilter: The Tuesday Huddle

Hey, if the folks behind the Buffalo, NY logo and slogan are any indication, you probably can just show up to some branding offices and say "I work here now" and start getting paid.

Two fonts, one which is horrific, and an animal that, while it shares the name, doesn't actually exist there. The opposite of real. Can't make this shit up.

posted by dfleming at 02:35 PM on February 25

SportsFilter: The Tuesday Huddle

I would love to have been a part of the consulting team that got paid 6 figures to come up with that logo.

posted by tahoemoj at 02:03 PM on February 25

SportsFilter: The Tuesday Huddle

They are referring to the helmet as a "logo". Interesting.

It's not the physical helmet the players are wearing that is the logo - they have a drawn version that is their actual logo. They don't put the logo on their helmet because then they'd get into a whole "helmets all the way down" drawing scenario and MC Escher seems above this kind of work.

posted by dfleming at 08:42 AM on February 25

SportsFilter: The Tuesday Huddle

Major helmet redesign in the works for the Cleveland Browns.

Orange is the new orange.

They are referring to the helmet as a "logo". Interesting. That means that Neil Patrick Harris' Oscar ceremony underwear is a logo.

Cue the footage of Crocodile Dundee brandishing a Bengals helmet and saying: "Oh, that's not a logo. THIS is a logo".

posted by beaverboard at 12:33 AM on February 25

SportsFilter: The Tuesday Huddle

Two good Grantland pieces: Charlie Pierce asks if the NFL is leaning on networks to not cover the Aaron Hernandez trial and how NBA teams are using creative contracts for 2nd round picks and D-League maybes to work around the salary cap:

"Alonzo Gee has been on five teams since early July. He became a punch line among NBA trade cognoscenti as his nonguaranteed $3 million contract for 2014-15 morphed into a trade chip teams used to clear cap space and facilitate complex transactions."

posted by yerfatma at 01:19 PM on February 24

SportsFilter: The Monday Huddle

Thanks Bonkers, you saved me looking that up after hearing about it on Football Weekly.

posted by yerfatma at 01:05 PM on February 24

SportsFilter: The Monday Huddle

Is it an '89 LeBaron? #johnvoightscar

posted by dfleming at 10:30 AM on February 24

SportsFilter: The Monday Huddle

I own a piece of automotive equipment that supposedly once belonged to a junior member of the Cianci family.

I only found that out after the seller, who has a legitimate business enterprise, insisted that I pay cash and that there would be no invoice or receipt.

When I said that I would like to have some record of the transaction, he said to shaddup, that I was lucky he didn't charge more because of the family history on the item.

Not sure if that would be called Provenance or Providence.

I have no idea if that sales guy is now rolled up in a rug somewhere, or if my gear is one day going to be impounded for investigative reasons.

I know what you're thinking. It's not a backhoe. Or a DeVille.

posted by beaverboard at 10:06 AM on February 24

SportsFilter: The Monday Huddle

Don't worry, they'll let Buddy Cianci take care of it

I'd love for Larry Lucchino to stop by the Ciancis for a fireside chat.

posted by yerfatma at 08:17 AM on February 24

SportsFilter: The Monday Huddle

How (not) to respond to a vicious tackle:

posted by Bonkers at 10:33 PM on February 23

SportsFilter: The Monday Huddle

Stark received his nickname as a plebe at Annapolis in 1899. There was an entertainer named Betty Stark who was quite popular at the time.

I've always thought it was from a misremembered quote of John Stark's.

Love to know where they think the State of RI is going to come up with money to build a new stadium for them.

Don't worry, they'll let Buddy Cianci take care of it (since he's not otherwise busy being a mayor); he knows a guy...

posted by Bonkers at 10:21 PM on February 23

Igor Larionov reflects on playing for Red Army, and what is wrong with North American hockey

Love The Professor.

posted by holden at 09:54 PM on February 23

Igor Larionov reflects on playing for Red Army, and what is wrong with North American hockey

I think people need to give it some time still.

If you watch the game being played now compared to the 80s (which was incredibly high scoring), you'll see that the individual skill on display now is greater (on average) than back then. And it's greater than it was in the 90s, and probably greater still than the 00s.

You see plays now that were considered "amazing" back then (reverse passes when going behind the net, or between-the-leg passes/shots), becoming commonplace.

The age of Youtube is going to bring out even more creativity from young players.

I mean, watch these kids play!

posted by grum@work at 09:36 PM on February 23

SportsFilter: The Monday Huddle

There was an entertainer named Betty Stark who was quite popular at the time.

I'm just remembering that the same thing happened to Elijah "ZaSu" Pitts when he played for the Packers.

posted by beaverboard at 09:36 PM on February 23

Igor Larionov reflects on playing for Red Army, and what is wrong with North American hockey

Maybe international ice would help but my gut feeling is there just aren't enough Datsyuks in the world for NHL hockey to be played the way Larianov imagines.

Those CSKA Moscow teams that Larianov played with got the pick of every draft-aged player in the country to fill out their roster, there was a ridiculous depth of talent. Practice 8 hours a day with those teammates to bake in some chemistry and the on-ice understanding gets to be telepathic.

I'm not sure how in the modern world you would draw the same level of talent together for long enough to build up that understanding. Watching old Red Army highlights its the puck movement that is amazing, they absolutely know/trust that someone will be there on the end of those blind passes. If anyone misses their spot those great passes turn into bad turnovers, pucks floating around in the middle of the neutral zone.

Unless we start cloning Sedins I don't see how there would ever be enough players with the right vision & cohesiveness to see a league-wide move to puck-movement offences.

posted by deflated at 05:48 PM on February 23

Igor Larionov reflects on playing for Red Army, and what is wrong with North American hockey

Advanced stats are finally gaining traction in NHL circles, and they tend to support the idea that puck possession, rather than dump/chase/forecheck, is far more efficient offensively. With any luck (and maybe some help from the league cracking down on obstruction again) perhaps we can get back some of this. Because widening the rinks, unfortunately, seems unlikely to happen.

posted by Mookieproof at 04:53 PM on February 23

Igor Larionov reflects on playing for Red Army, and what is wrong with North American hockey

I'm all for that idea, too Howard. And like yerfatma, sadly think it's a pipe dream.

BTW--did anyone else watch ESPN's 30 for 30 on the Miracle on Ice? Thought it was brilliant in that it was told from the Soviet players' perspective, framed by Slava Fetisov's road trip to lake Placid with his 21 year old daughter.

posted by tahoemoj at 04:38 PM on February 23

Igor Larionov reflects on playing for Red Army, and what is wrong with North American hockey

One theme keeps coming back to me: "Widen the rinks to the international standard".

This. I'm all for tradition, but Eddie Shore wasn't playing in a league where the average guy was 6'2", 200 pounds and could skate this fast. The objections in the pull quote sound a lot like non-English football players talking about the English approach to the sport.

posted by yerfatma at 04:11 PM on February 23

SportsFilter: The Monday Huddle

to mix and match a bit, Harold "Betty" Stark

Stark received his nickname as a plebe at Annapolis in 1899. There was an entertainer named Betty Stark who was quite popular at the time.

As long as you're talking about admirals, why not include William F. "Bull" Halsey. He disliked the nickname, was usually known as "Bill" in Navy circles, but the press and public forced it upon him. There is an apocryphal story that "Bull" might have started as a simple typo when a right middle finger or index finger missed by one key.

posted by Howard_T at 03:54 PM on February 23

Igor Larionov reflects on playing for Red Army, and what is wrong with North American hockey

"Throw it in deep and forecheck. Set up the trap when the other team gains control in its own end." This seems to be the mantra for today's game. The only real creativity you see now is on turnovers in the neutral zone or the offensive zone, and avoiding these keeps players from trying to do something other than the throw and go game. The skating skills in today's game are as good or better than they ever were. Perhaps that's part of the problem, defensemen are more mobile than "back in the day", so forwards cannot maneuver as freely as they once did. One theme keeps coming back to me: "Widen the rinks to the international standard". Of course, this means that owners will have to give up a few rows of high-priced seats. So much for that idea.

posted by Howard_T at 03:32 PM on February 23

Igor Larionov reflects on playing for Red Army, and what is wrong with North American hockey

Incredibly well-said. This piece sort of tracks the evolution of the NHL from the introduction of eastern Europeans to the game we see today. I absolutely love hockey, and appreciate the NHL for having the best players in the world. But I'm beginning to tire of the chip and chase game every team plays, typically out of a fear of being counterpunched off of a turnover.* Even the cycling-puck control game guys like Larionov brought with them has morphed into a throw it around the boards/deep behind the net and let the big wingers fight over it type of cycle, rather than the freewheeling style that used the entire ice surface.

* I also recognize the irony of being a Devils fan and saying that, when it was the 94-95 Devils who probably did the most to destroy the freewheeling play of the late 80s and early 90s.

posted by tahoemoj at 03:13 PM on February 23

SportsFilter: The Monday Huddle

Montreal Canadiens defenseman P.K. Subban and Willie O'Ree, the first black man to play in the National Hockey League, sit down with ESPN's John Saunders.

posted by rumple at 02:41 PM on February 23

SportsFilter: The Monday Huddle

The Red Sox reportedly have gotten Yoan Moncada for a reported $31.5m bonus, with an additional $31.5m overage tax for going over the limit for international bonus money.

It's a bloody lot of money for a 19-year-old, although having watched him play a couple of times, he's as real a deal as a 19-year-old can be. My guess for where he's going to play - he'll come to the majors just as Ortiz is retiring in 1-2 years, and they'll shove Sandoval to DH at that time, rather than shipping Bogaerts out or making an outfielder out of him and reducing his positional value.

posted by dfleming at 02:06 PM on February 23

SportsFilter: The Monday Huddle

It was t̶w̶e̶n̶t̶y̶ thirty years ago today, Sgt. Pepper taught the band to play

posted by beaverboard at 02:04 PM on February 23

SportsFilter: The Monday Huddle

Love the Upton name thing, which triggers my long held fascination with non-given-name nicknames and other related curiosities.

There seems to be an old tradition among various groups such as business executives and the military of people being called by a name that has no relation to their given first or middle names, such as Lloyd M. "Pete" Bucher or H.R. "Bob" Haldeman and on the women's side, Melinda Lou "Wendy" Thomas. Or, to mix and match a bit, Harold "Betty" Stark.

In my scoring system, you get full marks if your non-related nickname is a real name like Bob or Jack.

Honorable mention goes to folks like Kenneth Stanley "Bud" Adams or Gary Lester "Bubba" Watson because, heck, anybody could end up with a nickname like that no matter what your given names are. Butch and Buster and some others are in that group.

You get much more honorable mention if your nickname is cooler and more distinctive than Bud and Bubba but doesn't border on the absurd, like "The Great Asparagus". Anyone can have a really nutty nickname. No matter how cool your name is, you are likely never going to be king of this category because of Tug McGraw and Stonewall Jackson. They rule.

(In the smoke-filled late 70's, I did think that Bake McBride was a world class moniker).

You get major mention for having a legendary nickname that many people think is your real name, like Magic or Tiger and you totally own those names in perpetuity.

You want to be really cool, you go in the other direction and have a regular name with an initial that is only there to mess with the minds of curious nerds like me. Harry S. Truman's legal middle name is "S". Yer goddamn right. Fuckin' A.

posted by beaverboard at 01:48 PM on February 23

SportsFilter: The Monday Huddle

Love to know where they think the State of RI is going to come up with money to build a new stadium for them.

Whatever they do, they shouldn't ask a certain Red Sox alumni to be the pitch man for some public Rhode Island funds...

posted by grum@work at 01:18 PM on February 23

SportsFilter: The Monday Huddle

Sort of the best part, right? They're complaining about poor attendance in spite of the Pawsox success but not considering the economy. Love to know where they think the State of RI is going to come up with money to build a new stadium for them.

Bayer Leverkusen forget the golden (shirt) rule: somebody mark the keeper!

posted by yerfatma at 12:34 PM on February 23

SportsFilter: The Monday Huddle

"[Pawsox owner] Ben [Mondor] was a giant among men who saved baseball for the State of Rhode Island," Red Sox president/CEO Larry Lucchino 2010

Obviously their love of Ben Franklin overrides their love of Ben Mondor.

posted by grum@work at 12:24 PM on February 23

SportsFilter: The Monday Huddle

"[Pawsox owner] Ben [Mondor] was a giant among men who saved baseball for the State of Rhode Island," Red Sox president/CEO Larry Lucchino — 2010

"Screw the history, let's move the team to Providence," Sox owners — 2015

posted by yerfatma at 10:16 AM on February 23

SportsFilter: The Monday Huddle

B.J. Upton is now going as Melvin Upton Jr.

Perplexing logic at work in the creation of this one:

a) His father's name is neither B.J., nor Melvin (his birth name), but instead Manny; and
b) B.J. originally stood for Bossman Jr., which was a take on his dad's nickname.

Honestly, I don't think it's the most likely M name Braves fans will be yelling about him.

posted by dfleming at 09:57 AM on February 23

Chargers, Raiders Pursue Shared Stadium in Los Angeles

Hot day in the city
Running out to grab a beer
My baby don't mind, cause I got the time
Been outta work a year
Roll on up to my favorite joint
Head on in, gonna open that spout
Bartender smiles, cause together we been miles
Then I hear that familiar shout
WHO LET THE DOGS OUT...

posted by holden at 09:06 PM on February 22

Chargers, Raiders Pursue Shared Stadium in Los Angeles

There may be a few woof woofs in there that the boat captain thought was superfluous.

It's a thinly veiled reference to Benedict Art Modell and the Dawg Pound.

posted by beaverboard at 04:21 PM on February 22

Chargers, Raiders Pursue Shared Stadium in Los Angeles

Yeah, but what about the giant cigarette boat playing just the "WHO LET THE DOGS OUT?!" part of "Who Let the Dogs Out?" on an endless loop while idling near the docks looking for tourists?

Are there verses (other parts) to that song?

posted by holden at 02:45 PM on February 22

SportsFilter: The Saturday Huddle

I concur; excellent movie.

posted by bender at 12:45 PM on February 22

Chargers, Raiders Pursue Shared Stadium in Los Angeles

Not to quibble, but I think they moored the Chesapeake around when Harborplace opened, and the Torsk and the Constellation were there much longer.

Yeah, but what about the giant cigarette boat playing just the "WHO LET THE DOGS OUT?!" part of "Who Let the Dogs Out?" on an endless loop while idling near the docks looking for tourists? Without Camden Yards you don't have that.

posted by yerfatma at 10:00 AM on February 22

Chargers, Raiders Pursue Shared Stadium in Los Angeles

The thing I like best about that area is the Fells Point pub crawl.

posted by rcade at 09:24 AM on February 22

Chargers, Raiders Pursue Shared Stadium in Los Angeles

Over the years historic ships and other things have been added.

Not to quibble, but I think they moored the Chesapeake around when Harborplace opened, and the Torsk and the Constellation were there much longer. They do keep adding new ones from time to time, and there are always those big weekends when the Danish fleet comes for a visit.

The big reason they put Camden Yards down there was that the harbor crowds would benefit the ballpark and vice versa. I mean, nobody was making a day of it out at Memorial Stadium, but you can go down early and get overpriced lunch at Harborplace and then walk up to see the O's play. Anyone with their head on straight goes to Lexington Market for crabcakes, though.

But the Inner Harbor was totally a tourist attraction for a long time before the Camden Yards refit -- it was the Baltimore tourist attraction, I should say. Sure, building ballparks helped business, but Mr. Rouse's Harborplace development was the earlier revitalizing element that set the stage for bringing the stadiums, which of course in their turn helped bring gameday crowds to the inner harbor.

I'm sure the AVAM brings in hordes of football fans slavering for outsider art, as well.

I think the biggest success of Camden Yards and PSINet Stadium is the nice egress to streets and highways. Compared to other local football venues, traffic is a breeze.

posted by Hugh Janus at 01:17 AM on February 22

Chargers, Raiders Pursue Shared Stadium in Los Angeles

What is a "true urban ballpark"? One that is in the city as opposed to suburbs? Has to be baseball-only as opposed to dual-use? Has to be retro in styling? Has to not be surrounded by parking lots?

posted by holden at 12:47 AM on February 22

SportsFilter: The Saturday Huddle

disgruntled point guard Benedict Cumberbatch

So now he can play imitation games?

The Imitation Game is worth the price. A bit of WWII and cold war history, a bit about Asberger's Syndrome, and a bit about attitudes toward homosexuality. Good stuff.

posted by Howard_T at 09:15 PM on February 21

SportsFilter: The Saturday Huddle

The Suns have traded their disgruntled point guard Benedict Cumberbatch to the Miami Heat.

posted by beaverboard at 06:55 PM on February 21

Chargers, Raiders Pursue Shared Stadium in Los Angeles

I don't think the Inner Harbor would be successful without those stadiums. It was declining as a tourist and local draw, dropping from 18 million visitors in year one to 11 million in year two.

The link calls Camden Yards the "first true urban ballpark constructed in almost a century." Though a lot of stadium revitalization claims end up bogus, that's one I'd call massively successful.

posted by rcade at 10:18 AM on February 21

Chargers, Raiders Pursue Shared Stadium in Los Angeles

Baltimore's Inner Harbor is a good example. Having Camden Yards and the Ravens stadium in the area instead of somewhere in the 'burbs has made a huge difference there.

The Inner Harbor had been "renewed" before Camden Yards and the Ravens' Stadium were built. It has been a continuing effort in Baltimore to build on what had been started with the Pratt Street and Light Street Pavilions and the Aquarium. The pavilions offered some good restaurants and shops, and the Aquarium attracted a lot of people to the area. Over the years historic ships and other things have been added. The point is that Camden Yards replaced a chunk of underutilized land with a baseball park, thereby bringing a lot more people to the Inner Harbor shops and restaurants on game days. I'm sure the Ravens do the same. The point is that the Inner Harbor development was well underway before either stadium was built. It moght be that the stadia were located as they are because of the Inner Harbor's success.

posted by Howard_T at 12:09 AM on February 21

Chargers, Raiders Pursue Shared Stadium in Los Angeles

Arlington happily took on the tax burden of JerryWorld

Arlington TX became infamous for deciding to fund stadiums for the Cowboys and Rangers instead of investing in municipal infrastructure, and until recently was the largest US city or town without any sort of public transportation system.

Area voters have repeatedly refused to allow earmarked tax revenues to be used to fund public transportation, thereby fully reversing the Jagger/Richards theory which states that you don't always get what you want, but you do get what you need.

posted by beaverboard at 11:59 PM on February 20

SportsFilter: The Friday Huddle

Mayweather-Pacquiao is finally official.

posted by Bonkers at 08:15 PM on February 20

Chargers, Raiders Pursue Shared Stadium in Los Angeles

Pro teams are so good at these stadium extortion schemes I'll be surprised if L.A. gets any of these teams.

I actually wouldn't be surprised if they got the Chargers, who have been threatening to leave for LA for a looooooooong time (around ten years) and San Diego's done basically nothing about it. At this point, after poisoning the well with their moving threats and their prior lease contract with the city (where all their games were basically sellouts, with the city picking up the tab for any unsold tickets while the team went 1-15) the owners don't really have the backing of the public. San Diego's most recent response was to put together a committee to try to find a site for a new stadium, which in SD terms means they're not doing anything, just punting the issue down the road for the next administration to handle. There's just not any kind of political will for a stadium and SD politicians are too cowardly to really make a move one way or the other, so unless there's a way to get one built with public money without having it go to an election referendum it's not going to happen.

posted by LionIndex at 07:16 PM on February 20

Chargers, Raiders Pursue Shared Stadium in Los Angeles

Again - I think under the right circumstances, a stadium could be a good thing.

Coors Field in Denver seems like another positive example, though it might be the end of the LoDo revitalization rather than the beginning.

Many in Dallas are still grumbling that Mayor Laura Miller helped kill any idea of the Cowboys building downtown. It seems to me there was plenty of opportunity there -- some parts of downtown are pretty raggedy -- but Arlington happily took on the tax burden of JerryWorld.

posted by rcade at 07:09 PM on February 20

Chargers, Raiders Pursue Shared Stadium in Los Angeles

It will also revitalize an area if the stadium is occupied for decades (like Camden)

That is a fantastic point. In 1992 teams didn't really move. We were only 8 years removed from the Colts packing up in the middle of the night and causing a scandal when they left Baltimore. Nowadays all but the most well-established teams seem to be carpetbaggers constantly eyeing a better deal in Shelbyville or points South. How excited are fans in Oklahoma City to have a good team come to them from Seattle and now there are already grumblings about market size?

Sports teams, the Olympics, etc can revitalize an area, but I don't think it's currently likely. I feel like they've used the fact teams have revitalized downtowns to leverage giant pots of cash out of municipalities and the cost-benefit ratio doesn't make sense anymore.

posted by yerfatma at 02:48 PM on February 20

Chargers, Raiders Pursue Shared Stadium in Los Angeles

I don't know if that's the answer: because they're only elected for a short time and because people tend to vote against their long-term interests for this kind of crap, isn't it more of an education issue?

I don't think so, at least not more so on this topic than any other relating to how our democratic institutions would be better if we had a more informed voter.

I think, in theory, it's a great idea for a politician to say "I want to bring a professional sports team to town" and for the public to say "I want that too!" The devil is in the details of the deal, which i s what we send elected representatives to do for us. We can vote 'em out, but for the people of Miami, that's little consequence when you're financing the deal for the next 50 years.

I was in the room for a lot of discussions about a CFL stadium (as an economist who brought in a lot of the great economic work being done on how the infrastructure and development promises rarely come to be) - and often, I felt like for the elected officials, you could move a decimal point and it doesn't matter. They're there to make a deal, and unless that happens, it's a failure. They don't negotiate well because, deep down, they're not very willing to say no.

A stadium project can revitalize a downtown.

I think, for the most part, those days are gone - at least in the sense of sustainable growth.

The last decade of fiscal constraint means we're putting these things in suburbia because the land value is lower and there's more of it. This is theorized in Carson, not downtown LA. That puts huge pressures on transportation, planning and county infrastructure to make it work. Roads need to be built and adjusted; public transportation now has huge swaths of people moving from one place to another it didn't before. Costly water, sewer, and environmental impacts as well.

It will also revitalize an area if the stadium is occupied for decades (like Camden) - so when the Braves go ahead and move out of Turner Field after 19 years, and the whole area declines, it's a problem. It's not a great city planning tool unless you know it'll be there for the length of time it takes to truly build great infrastructure.

Again - I think under the right circumstances, a stadium could be a good thing. Camden Yards, in today's dollars, cost $185 million and is likely paying dividends now that it's into its third decade of occupancy.

Marlins Park cost 4 times that, meaning in order to realize equivalent dividends, either they need to stay there 4 times as long, or do a lot more for the surrounding area each year. Lots of that ancillary investment and improvement is public, to which the public has less money due to the deal than it had before.

So - I do get what you're saying, but the nature of the current stadium deal isn't likely to do to many places what Baltimore's has, unless the collectively political realm gets a hell of a lot better at negotiating.

posted by dfleming at 02:05 PM on February 20

Chargers, Raiders Pursue Shared Stadium in Los Angeles

It's becoming more and more clear that major sports corporations are becoming more and more of a plague on the cities they're in ...

They aren't just a plague. A stadium project can revitalize a downtown. Baltimore's Inner Harbor is a good example. Having Camden Yards and the Ravens stadium in the area instead of somewhere in the 'burbs has made a huge difference there.

I don't see cities or states ever stopping these stadium deals. It would have to come from the federal government or possibly a state voter referendum.

posted by rcade at 01:44 PM on February 20

Chargers, Raiders Pursue Shared Stadium in Los Angeles

the only real opportunity for reform is a collective spinal-installation procedure for elected officials

I don't know if that's the answer: because they're only elected for a short time and because people tend to vote against their long-term interests for this kind of crap, isn't it more of an education issue? I do hold out some hope when I see outlets like deadspin constantly calling out stadium deals but it's unlikely to seep into mainstream nightly news when each of the channels is beholden to the NFL.

Hey, that's a pretty impressive piece of evil dealing by the NFL, getting their hands in the pockets of all 4 major networks. Plus Rupert Murdoch owns a bunch of papers and radio stations. It's almost like we had those laws against this kind of crap for a reason.

posted by yerfatma at 01:12 PM on February 20

Chargers, Raiders Pursue Shared Stadium in Los Angeles

It's becoming more and more clear that major sports corporations are becoming more and more of a plague on the cities they're in, or could be in. It's akin economic development* in general - every place's willingness to sweeten the deal through investment and tax breaks to get someone to come to town makes the upside for the broader public a heck of a lot smaller, and then people make deals that work politically in the short-term and where the suffering comes in over the long-term.

There's no benefit to Goodell stepping in, nor would he have the backing of an ownership that makes off like bandits in this game of Russian roulette. Anything he does reduces the leverage that owners are currently using to stranglehold cities into better deals and decrease their capital responsibilities. Yeah, it's a bit embarrassing and chaotic and the media will have a field day in the short-term, but ultimately Goodell makes his coin if the league owners makes theirs - and this is big coin negotiation for 10% of the owners, plus those looking at their own stadiums and leases in the near future.

Like the Olympics, the only real opportunity for reform is a collective spinal-installation procedure for elected officials to be able to walk away from marketable shit because the dollars and cents don't make sense. Too many of them see the big headline and don't care what it costs because it temporarily bumps them up in the polls.

I predict nobody ends up in LA in the next couple of years - one, because California is broke and the public money is still going to be required for a shared stadium, and two, because deep-down there's a ton of risk moving into a market potentially at the same time as another team. Is constantly dysfunctional Oakland really reveling at the prospect of trying to rebuild the other 75% of their fan base (they estimate 25% of their fan base is in Orange County/LA) in a market they're likely to be the second best team in at least for a while? You can't even get people hyped about it being Brooklyn vs. Manhattan, or Manhattan vs. Queens, because it's the same geographic location in Carson everyone goes to.

You've got to captivate a market, one now you're sharing with another brand-spanking new team, and it's been a while since you did anything worth marketing on the field. Not exactly a market that screams "get at me, bro."

* I spent much of my career to date in economic development. It's game theory where only some of the people have gone past watching A Beautiful Mind in their studies, and unfortunately all those people are employed by the one side who's winning left, right, and centre.

posted by dfleming at 12:33 PM on February 20

Chargers, Raiders Pursue Shared Stadium in Los Angeles

Pro teams are so good at these stadium extortion schemes I'll be surprised if L.A. gets any of these teams. If St. Louis loses the Rams I fear that Shahid Khan will be tempted to move the Jaguars out of Jacksonville, since his Flex-N-Gate auto parts company is based in Urbana, Illinois, and he originally sought to buy the Rams.

But Khan put a lot of money into huge videoboards and other improvements at Everbank Field and he just unveiled a shipyards development project that would turn the grimy industrial zone around the stadium into a hotel/restaurant/entertainment district and no doubt make a lot of money for him. If that idea gets anywhere he'll need the Jaguars to stay around.

posted by rcade at 12:26 PM on February 20

SportsFilter: The Friday Huddle

Mark Mulder sees Jackie Robinson West scandal as an excuse to settle scores from his childhood.

Details on the MLB pace of play changes which I am happy to report include keeping one foot in the batter's box, Nomar Garciappara's OCD be damned.

posted by yerfatma at 11:57 AM on February 20

SportsFilter: The Friday Huddle

Bob Knight, usher.

posted by yerfatma at 11:16 AM on February 20

Chargers, Raiders Pursue Shared Stadium in Los Angeles

LA Chargers? LA Raiders? LA Rams?

From zero teams to three teams in the blink of an eye?

posted by grum@work at 10:51 AM on February 20

SportsFilter: The Friday Huddle

Finally, a legitimate career opportunity in play-by-play for those loyal to Winterfell.

posted by dfleming at 08:59 AM on February 20

SportsFilter: The Friday Huddle

The Texas Rangers have signed Roughned Odor's younger brother Roughned Odor.

posted by rcade at 08:52 AM on February 20

SportsFilter: The Thursday Huddle

Best thing about that match was the Umpires taking everyone off for a 45 minute lunch break when the Kiwi's were about five minutes away from winning.

England really are dreadful at the one day game.

posted by Mr Bismarck at 12:49 AM on February 20

SportsFilter: The Wednesday Huddle

Yup, they fired a ref right after the game to cover up a scandal that didn't yet exist.

Now the referees union is demanding an apology from ESPN for its shoddy reporting. There was no on-field official fired, but supposedly an NFL employee was. What a mess the NFL has made of this whole thing.

posted by Howard_T at 11:27 PM on February 19

Revealed: the ghost game bet on around the world ... that never actually took place.

At Boston Celtics home games there is usually a halftime game between 2 youth teams. Believe it or not during one of these the 2 guys sitting next to us had a not unsubstantial bet on it. Some will bet on anything.

posted by Howard_T at 11:22 PM on February 19

SportsFilter: The Thursday Huddle

If any of you are watching the Cricket World Cup at the moment...

England are being humiliated.

posted by owlhouse at 11:14 PM on February 19

SportsFilter: The Thursday Huddle

Jonathan Toews buys Girl Scout cookies from 5-year-old Hawks fan

posted by tommytrump at 10:38 PM on February 19

SportsFilter: The Thursday Huddle

Former Blazer, Sonic and Spur Jerome Kersey passed away last night at the age of 52 of an apparent blood clot that traveled to his lung causing a pulmonary thromboembolism.

posted by Ufez Jones at 05:08 PM on February 19

SportsFilter: The Thursday Huddle

Awesome.

In other news, rugby appears to have a concussion protocol in which a player is sent off for testing while a substitute plays for him, then can return to play if testing decides his brains are unscrambled. Soccer could learn from that.

posted by rcade at 01:03 PM on February 19

SportsFilter: The Thursday Huddle

Grum, that is outstanding.

posted by billsaysthis at 12:04 PM on February 19

Revealed: the ghost game bet on around the world ... that never actually took place.

How much of a degenerate gambler do you have to be to bet on a friendly match between Belarussian squads?

Probably someone right up there with the guy who bets on the NASCAR Truck Series. Or Div-III women's basketball.

posted by Bonkers at 11:36 AM on February 19