FanDuel - WFBC

July 20, 2007

Vick to still play.: "The Associated Press reported that after consulting with the Falcons, NFL commissioner Roger Goodell and top league officials agreed Wednesday to let Vick play as the legal process determines the facts. A person with knowledge of the meeting, who requested anonymity so the case would not be influenced, said the NFL would stick to that position for the foreseeable future, despite its new personal conduct policy, the AP reported. "

posted by FonGu to football at 06:26 AM - 56 comments

I know we beat this topic up a few days back. However, in light of Pac Man, et.al., doesn't this make Goodell a hypocrite? Show me the money baby!!

posted by FonGu at 06:28 AM on July 20

What a shocker -- guys who make money for the NFL stay in the game while the guys who don't get the suspensions. I don't mind letting Vick play while the proceedings play out (innocent until proven guilty and all that), but the uneven treatment of players makes Goddell look like a stooge.

posted by wfrazerjr at 06:43 AM on July 20

Okay, so a guy who his arrested repeatedly, has to talk to police repeatedly, but is never brought up on charges gets suspended for a year. A guy who is indicted on several charges at one time gets to play. I get it. It's not what you do, it's how often! Great policy there Commish.

posted by apoch at 06:44 AM on July 20

I think part of the difference with Pacman was his failure to report to his team and the league all of the incidents. The Titans and the NFL heard about them when the media got ahold of them. Pacman and Henry had multiple encounters with the police. Vick has had one. Those guys were suspended because they repeatedly put themselves in a position that would bring bad publicity to the league. I don't think the league should suspend players for being accused of a crime, unless there are additional circumstances that indicate that the player doesn't have his behavior under control (e.g. Pacman's love for brawls at strip clubs).

posted by bperk at 07:29 AM on July 20

Those guys were suspended because they repeatedly put themselves in a position that would bring bad publicity to the league. Blowing off a congressional meeting, flipping off fans, caught in an airport with an "unknown" substance in a hide-away bottle, knowingly giving a woman herpes and using an alias, dogfighting charges. Are you sure none of those things brought bad publicity to the league. To me it is a case of discrimination. He is a quarterback, the most important player on his team, one of the "faces" of the league so he gets special treatment. If you are a somewhat unknown lineman, DB, etc... the hammer comes down. It seriously does sound like a case of discrimination and I wouldn't be surprised to see Jones, Henry and Johnsons lawyers all over this one. Maybe the NFL should institute a Designated Player rule. Yeah, I know, not that one. Where a team can designate two players that can do whatever the hell they want without any risk of suspension.

posted by urall cloolis at 07:48 AM on July 20

Blowing off a congressional meeting . . . It was a lobbying event and was completely voluntary for the purpose of doing a public service for after school programs. His flight was delayed. . . . flipping off fans . . . He was fined. . . . caught in an airport with an "unknown" substance in a hide-away bottle . . . The police said there was no illegal substance. He was also drug tested and the tests were negative. He was completely exonerated in this instance and trotting it out is just ridiculous. . . . knowingly giving a woman herpes and using an alias . . . This is a civil matter and completely unproven. . . . dogfighting charges . . . This is the only one worth discussing. There is a difference between being under intense scrutiny and being criticized for foolishness (like most of your examples) and being repeatedly involved in police incidents. Vick has been involved with two police incidents, the airport incident where he was completely exonerated, and the current very serious incident. Until the facts come out, how long do you suspend him for? Do you suspend him for the seriousness of the crime that he is being accused of (which I would suspect would have to be an entire season)? Or do you suspend him for hanging out with the wrong people (which would be a much shorter suspension or none at all)? I think that is the problem with suspending Vick. What exactly are you suspending him for?

posted by bperk at 08:11 AM on July 20

Those incidents DID bring bad publicity to the league- which is what you said he has not done. I never said they were all criminal acts, nor does the NFL personal conduct code specify that they need to be. I think the publicity from this episode is one hundred times worse than what Pacman, Henry or Johnson has brought to the NFL. Vick is a very public figure. Most fans could not pick Jones, Henry or Johnson out of a lineup. Like I said, the lawyers of the players already suspended should be all up the commissioners ass when they are made examples of and Vick skates away until convicted. I can see a discrimination suit or three in the making as we speak.

posted by urall cloolis at 08:41 AM on July 20

i'd have to totally agree with bperk, it has nothing to do with vicks position on the team or the money that he brings to the NFL.Pac man has a long list of"Proven" and charged offenses, thus warranting the suspension

posted by oh2rooper at 08:43 AM on July 20

My crystal ball says that this thread quickly devolves into a continuation of the previous (and closed) Vick/dog fighting thread.

posted by NoMich at 08:56 AM on July 20

I never said they were all criminal acts, nor does the NFL personal conduct code specify that they need to be. I think it does. Here is the policy I am using as the basis of my comments. Criminal behavior or getting in trouble while your behavior is being evaluated (Pacman) are the ways to get a suspension.

posted by bperk at 08:56 AM on July 20

Those incidents DID bring bad publicity to the league... No, not really. Just to Vick himself.

posted by BornIcon at 09:09 AM on July 20

It's easy to say "He Plays" right now when camps haven't even started. Once all the media starts swarming while the team's trying to prepare for the season, and once the prospect of taking this act on the road, having all the fans heckling him, barking at him, playing "Who Let The Dogs Out" (which I heard the league may ban from NFL P.A. systems during Falcon road games), the team may choose to grant him some time away. The fact Joey Harrington is now their second-string option, not Schaub, may make that decision much tougher, though. As for this "Bad publicity to the league" thing, I don't see an end to that. Goodell would have to start suspending two or three players a week.

posted by dyams at 09:14 AM on July 20

As for this "Bad publicity to the league" thing, I don't see an end to that. Goodell would have to start suspending two or three players a week. ... Which is, of course, Goodell's own damn fault. He set the precedent.

posted by cl at 09:38 AM on July 20

As little as I think of Vick as a quarterback and more importantly as a person, he has not been convicted of anything, and nothing should warrant a suspension at this time. He is entitled to make a living until justice runs its course. I do think the Atlanta Falcons are better off without him, and if it were my team I would be moving to replace him, because he will eventually be going away, and isn't good for business.

posted by Atheist at 09:53 AM on July 20

nothing should warrant a suspension at this time Pacman was never proven guilty of any of the charges against him. Does he deserve to be suspended? Absolutely. Vick wasn't charged with anything in Miami? Was he carrying a hide-away bottle? Yes he was. While he didn't fo anything illegal, it seems to me this should be 1 strike against him and the recent mess the second. Pacman and Henry had more than two so MAYBE that is the discrepancy. Am I defending Goodell? NO. I think Vick should be gone from the NFL until he is exonerated (and I mean by some pretty overwhelming evidence). And how on earth can you say this doesn't bring the NFL into disrepute BornIcon? Isn't Vick basically a representative of the NFL. Most of the companies we work for would have fired us already if these things were this public. I am really surprised at Blank for letting him play while this is happening being as image conscious as he is. I wonder how long before PETA organizes protests at Home Depots.

posted by Ricardo at 10:00 AM on July 20

I thought Goodell was going to be a good commissioner, but it turns out he's nothing but a asshole. a guy with no name can't play, but a guy with a name gets to play. Yes Pacman shouldn't play, because he's thumbing his nose at the NFL. The part that gets me is that Vick lied right to Goodell's face about this, and he still gets to play. I'm ready to stop watching sports all together.

posted by steelers101 at 10:01 AM on July 20

Those guys were suspended because they repeatedly put themselves in a position that would bring bad publicity to the league. The bad publicity caused by Pacman Jones was a drop in the ocean compared to the attention being paid to Michael Vick's situation. Sports radio the past two days has been all-Vick all the time, and the mainstream media's all over it as well. Goodell's willingness to wait out a legal resolution for Vick feels like the star system at work. Vick moves a lot of merchandise and is one of the NFL's best known players, so he gets presumption of innocence. Pacman's a lesser known player in a small market, so he gets the boot. Personally, I wish the league would err on the side of presuming players innocent until a verdict or plea comes down. This would prevent players from being punished for things they turned out not to have done, such as when Nina Shahravan fabricated a sex assault claim against Michael Irvin and Erik Williams in 1996 and was later charged with filing a false complaint.

posted by rcade at 10:50 AM on July 20

Please correct me if I am wrong here, but I thought I heard that the Falcons were going to "recomend" to Vick the he take a "voluntary leave" and get his legal affairs in order. Or was this just speculation? Heard it on the morning drive.

posted by THX-1138 at 11:21 AM on July 20

A business (the NFL) which is reliant on publicity for practically everything, can't be held to the same standards as other businesses or people. The league wants every bit of coverage they can get, and then some, but the attention this is going to bring will be absolutely horrible for them, and Vick. There's no way in the world Vick will be able to handle the backlash from this. Hell, he gets heckled for his shitty passing and he flicks off fans. Add this issue to his shitty passing and he's probably going to lose it completely. A guy with the money Vick has can purchase enough legal power to bring practically any court to it's knees. If he winds up being aquitted, does that mean he's completely innocent? That's impossible to say, and recent history proves people will continue to assume Vick knew what was going on, condoned it, probably profited from it, and may have taken part in it. The NFL can't have the publicity they want to have, then avoid the stuff they wish they could avoid. Vick has been one narrowly-averted disaster after another, and I doubt it's going to stop. Goodell may be messing up with this whole can of worms he's opened (trying to clean up the league's image), but that's mainly because the problem will never go away entirely. And if the league has to wait to act until all these issues play out in court, they'll wind up never dealing with any of this stuff. It's truly the type of thing that could wind up ruining the sport.

posted by dyams at 11:37 AM on July 20

Goodell's willingness to wait out a legal resolution for Vick feels like the star system at work. What seems weird about this apparent dichotomy is the timing. If memory serves, Vick's house was first raided in April. Goodell suspended Pacman and Henry in May and Tank Johnson in June. It's not like he started throwing suspensions around and then the Vick thing showed up out of the blue and he said, "Uh oh." You would think he was aware that the "star system" dilemma had a reasonable chance of cropping up very soon.

posted by The Crafty Sousepaw at 12:04 PM on July 20

This offers a great opportunity for the Falcons to do the right thing. A. Blank is in a position to actually act on what he claims to want: a team with high character guys. Well here is your chance, Mr. Blank. If you really believe that character is an important commodity for a pro athlete, suspend Vick until the punishment handed down as part of a plea bargain --which is the most likely outcome of this fiasco-- is completed. Throw Joey on the field, lose 12 games this year, miss the playoffs, watch 'cat fancy' and DeAngelo seek greener pastures, and accept a 10% loss of season ticket holders. Send a the message that conviction is not a prerequisite of suspension. Let players know that just association with degenerate mutts, sociopaths, and criminals will cost them money and possibly their carer. Does the NFL really want Vick doing the perp walk on CNN with three homeboys at trial on a Friday afternoon, then playing on NBC the following Monday night with the Falcons? That is gonna produce interesting B-reel for the talking heads to dissect. Good luck spinning that, Mr Goodell.

posted by r8rh8r27 at 12:13 PM on July 20

And how on earth can you say this doesn't bring the NFL into disrepute BornIcon? My bad if you misunderstood. What I meant was that if anything, this has brought the bad publicity more towards Mike Vick himself than the NFL. The NFL has gotten bad publicity since the whole Pacman, Tank, Chris Henry incidents. This would prevent players from being punished for things they turned out not to have done, such as when Nina Shahravan fabricated a sex assault claim against Michael Irvin and Erik Williams in 1996 and was later charged with filing a false complaint. Geez rcade, why re-open old wounds? OUCH!!

posted by BornIcon at 12:20 PM on July 20

Props to THX-1138, first to mention this. ..."In what has quickly evolved into a collaborative effort that includes input of officials from the NFL, NFL Players Association and Atlanta Falcons, embattled quarterback Michael Vick could be urged to take a voluntary leave of absence to focus his energy on the legal challenges from a federal dogfighting indictment confronting him, sources said. " The hypocracy grows. Pacman's lawyer is going to have a field day with this crap.

posted by FonGu at 04:15 PM on July 20

A guy with the money Vick has can purchase enough legal power to bring practically any court to it's knees. This isn't any court, though. This is the Federal Government of the United States of America, and you can bet that prosecutors at that level take every case very, very seriously, and will use every resource at their disposal to attain a conviction, or at the very least, a plea bargain that is much more satisfactory to them than the defendant. Plus, Vick has been charged with conspiracy, which opens a whole new can of worms. He doesn't even necessarily need to be convicted, but if one of the indicted co-conspirators is convicted, Vick loses, too. Mike is flat stuck between Scylla and Charybdis. BornIcon, the NFL has been moving toward more of an international presence for years now. Believe it or not, there are literally billions of people around the world who have never heard of the NFL before. They're damn sure hearing about it now, and their immediate association is not with sports, but apparent barbarism and cruelty practiced by a man who is one of the public faces of the league. Mike Vick's personal problems be damned, he is hurting the NFL, in the last place they want to be hurt: the burgeoning international market.

posted by The_Black_Hand at 04:45 PM on July 20

literally billions of people around the world who have never heard of the NFL before...and their immediate association is not with sports, but apparent barbarism and cruelty Yeah, but dogfighting is very popular in many countries around the world.

posted by Venicemenace at 05:30 PM on July 20

Scylla and Charybdis. I went out for dinner last night and had a glass of Scylla, and my dinner companion had a 1/2 litre of the Charybdis. Both vintages were delightful, amusing, with fruity textures, and had delicate bouquets.

posted by tommytrump at 05:40 PM on July 20

Goodell invalidated his own conduct policy, made his authority as commisioner irrelevant, and called into question the integrity of the entire league in one single act. Vick's federal indictments carry much more weight and have much larger consequences to the accused than Pacman's local level probation violations. Here was an opportunity for the NFL to send a clear message to all the players and fans that no one is above the rules, but Goodell's nutsack shrivelled under pressure.

posted by irunfromclones at 05:49 PM on July 20

I'm pretty sure the NFL isn't danger of being brought down by the International Association of Dogfighters or some other crap. I just like the idea that a high profile NFL quarterback might be a dogfighting kingpin. This story needs Steven Segal before it can properly reach its true potential.

posted by WeedyMcSmokey at 05:53 PM on July 20

dogfighting is very popular in many countries around the world. Name 2 the NFL cares about.

posted by yerfatma at 06:06 PM on July 20

Careful, Mars- your logic sounds a slight hop away from, "pit bulls attack defenseless children and other people all the time"; therefore, it's OK to hang, drown, slam etc them to death... Goodell dropped the ball on this one by being inconsistent, but I can't fathom Blank's wait and see stance on this whole thing. The LAST thing I'd want as an owner going into training camp is the media circus/locker room cancer that having Vick on hand would bring- If it was me, I'd pull a Titans/Steve McNair and tell Mike he was not welcome at the facilities until he gets his sh*t in order... The Falcons would probably win more games this year with Harrington/Culpepper and no distractions to the team anyway...I know it's not fair to lock Vick out for only an indictment, but if you think about it, we're dealing with twilight zone situations in the NFL to begin with- I mean, how fair is a 35 million dollar signing bonus given to a kid who hasn't proven himself, just to play a game?

posted by don-peyote at 08:38 PM on July 20

Mars, you can try it again without "All you idiots..." being the first three words.

posted by justgary at 08:41 PM on July 20

Mars, I agree with a small part of what you say. Mere accusations should not sink someone. But this is different than taking the word of a drug-addicted stripper against him. This is a federal indictment. And the point many people here have made is that Goodell did not let Pacman Jones have the benefit of waiting for the legal process to play out. As for your last "argument," are you now saying that even if Vick did it, the dogs had it coming? Surely you aren't that depraved and illogical. You might want to stop and consider that the reason there are so many pit bull attacks on people is that people like the ones who ran the disgusting operation on Vick's property intentionally breed the dogs to be that way. If the dog doesn't seem violent enough, they kill it. So whether the dogs deserve what they got or not, many of these attacks you decry are on the heads of the fighting-dog breeders.

posted by olelefthander at 09:19 PM on July 20

dogfighting is very popular in many countries around the world. So are suicide bombings, so does that make it right?

posted by urall cloolis at 09:53 PM on July 20

"Sure, I'd do anything I could to help Mike," Reeves said. "I think he's basically a good person. Unfortunately it just seems like he's made some bad choices over the years with the company he keeps." -Dan Reeves Isn't that part of what the college experience, growing up, being a man is all about? Finding out what direction you want to go in life and as a result leaving behind the things that bring you down. I am not lifelong friends with every person I hung out with as a child. I learned to walk away from things that can bring you trouble. Vick (and every other athlete) owes nothing to the people he grew up with just because he was friends with them back in the day. He made a decision to go to college, play football and make a better life for himself and his family. He betrays no one by going in another direction. He owed no one a thing, other than some friendship for those that deserve it and continue to earn it. The fact that he now says everyone including his family took advantage of him and let him down is a major cop out. He is the one that experienced the college life, the NFL sessions and coaches, Union and commisioners teaching him how to take care of himself. He had the tools to do better and he still screwed up in a big way. He has only himself to blame in this situation.

posted by urall cloolis at 11:44 PM on July 20

Exactly how does the media/courts address Vick now? Is it Michael? Mike? Mr. Vick? Mr. Michael Vick? Ron Mexico? Godfather of All Dogfights? Ookie?

posted by urall cloolis at 12:13 AM on July 21

Vick will go down in history as ONE of the most OVERHYPED players in the history of the NFL. Mark my words.

posted by ggermanctl at 12:39 AM on July 21

..."Who Let The Dogs Out" (which I heard the league may ban from NFL P.A. systems during Falcon road games)... Perhaps we can substitute Patti Paige singing How Much is that Doggie in the Window? tommytrump, every time I drink Scylla, I have a hangover like I had 2 heads. Charybdis makes my stomach feel like there's a whirlpool inside. I really don't think Goodell has much choice other than to let events take their course before suspending Vick. The previous incidents were certainly indicators that we were not dealing with one of the "character guys" in the league, but even taken together in their worst light, they are not enought to cause the current situation to result in a suspension. That being said, I agree with all those who say that Vick's prospects are not good. You can bet that a federal prosecutor, looking to make a name for himself, given all of the resources he has, will be able to reduce Mr. Vick to a whipped puppy.

posted by Howard_T at 03:16 PM on July 21

So are suicide bombings, so does that make it right? Seriously??? Are you really equating what Michael Vick is accused of with sponsorship of a suicide bombing against human beings?

posted by Venicemenace at 02:13 PM on July 22

I am not comparing the two- the response was to dogfighting is very popular in many countries around the world.. There are a lot of things in other countries that are popular/acceptable and it doesn't make them right. Sorry I didn't list them all. It got your attention though didn't it? However I wouldn't feel as strongly if Mike Vick put himself in one of his dogfighting sheds, took a couple of his "weak" dogs and blew himself up with them. At least then more dogs wouldn't have had to suffer.

posted by urall cloolis at 07:07 PM on July 23

And before a "human life vs. dog life" response is posted- YES, knowing what I do now, I would rather see one dead Michael Vick than 60 to 100 dead dogs. That is how Jeffrey Dahmer, John Wayne Gacy, Ted Bundy and many more (mass) murderers, who got jaded by killing dogs then went on to humans, got started.

posted by urall cloolis at 08:26 PM on July 23

Vick to still play? Not quite, anymore.

posted by NerfballPro at 09:21 PM on July 23

I am glad that the commish made the decison, however delayed. I will still not shop at Home Depot- I will make do at Lowe's and other home improvement stores since Arthur Blank thinks his investment in Vick is more important than what made him the money to purchase Mr. Ookie's contract in the first place. He had the chance to sever ties before the NFL made its wise decision. My guess is that Ookie never plays another down in the NFL again. Unless the Raiders pick him up in 2012 or so. GOOD RIDDANCE!

posted by urall cloolis at 09:46 PM on July 23

bperk- did you even read the rules that you linked on the NFL Personal Conduct Policy? Prohibited Conduct It will be considered conduct detrimental for Covered Persons to engage in (or to aid, abet or conspire to engage in or to incite) violent and/or criminal activity. Every clause contains criminal and/or violent conduct. It never states CRIMINAL only and never states who or what the violence needs to be applied to.

posted by urall cloolis at 10:06 PM on July 23

The NFL said Vick would still get his preseason pay... But of course he will, loves.

posted by alumshubby at 05:34 AM on July 24

The league is going to take time to look into all the allegations against Vick, and I wouldn't be surprised if, after that, the Falcons bid farwell to Mike (release him).

posted by dyams at 07:33 AM on July 24

bperk- did you even read the rules that you linked on the NFL Personal Conduct Policy? Every clause contains criminal and/or violent conduct. It never states CRIMINAL only and never states who or what the violence needs to be applied to. Of course, I read it. It never mentions anything about the kind of standard you were applying based on the amount of bad publicity generated by the incidents. That's why I posted it.

posted by bperk at 08:33 AM on July 24

This is a damn shame! Ok, Mike Vick is probably going to be 'banned' from attending training camp, does that make him guilty? No. I am a huge dog lover and had a pitbull a few years back (he since passed) and let me just say this, he was more of a lovable, playful dog than the tiny, shit pekingese that I have now (It must be a Napoleon complex, who know's). My point is that Vick is guilty in so many people's eyes without him even given a 'fair trial'. I know, I know, this isn't a court of law but it is called the 'court of public opinion', isn't it? It's totally inhumane if in fact Vick was involved with any of these allegations but that's all they are at this time, allegations. Yes, it's a Federal investigation and all but that still doesn't mean he's guilty, it just means that every nook & cranny will be looked at and every stone will not be left unturned. Just let these people do their jobs and we'll soon all know what's really been going on. I know that we can all sit here, judge and snub our noses at Mike Vick for what's being alleged of him but let the chips fall where they may and the truth will eventually be revealed. It's called due process but let me just say this, Vick looks guilty as hell considering that this is a house he purchased for his family but saying that, it just doesn't mean that he was involved with any of these allegations. Haven't we learned anything with the Duke lacrosse case? Granted, they're two different cases (this one being a Federal case and all) but it still left a lot of people with their foot in their mouths (Nancy Grace anyone?)

posted by BornIcon at 09:00 AM on July 24

Yeah, BI, I was just thinking that if the NFL is keeping Vick from camp, I hope they know he is guilty. The training camp with a new coach is crucial and Vick and the Falcons are going to be at a huge disadvantage with him not attending camp.

posted by bperk at 10:15 AM on July 24

The NFL would look completely stupid if they were to allow the Falcons' camp to turn into the ridiculous media and picket hotbed (all for reasons outside of actual football) should the allow Vick to attend. There are still a lot of players on the Falcons who need to get ready to play football, make the team, and for some, it's their very first NFL camp. They're entitled to doing their jobs, too. Vick is still getting paid, and at this time, that's all the employer is required to do. Haven't we learned anything with the Duke lacrosse case? Granted, they're two different cases You're right, they are completely different. The fact remains, though, that Vick needs to think clearly for once in his life and realize he should focus on proving his innocence (if that's even possible) right now and not football. His track record for using common sense doesn't lead me to believe he'd come to that conclusion on his own. In my estimation, he owes it to his team to step back and allow them to move ahead.

posted by dyams at 11:47 AM on July 24

The training camp with a new coach is crucial and Vick and the Falcons are going to be at a huge disadvantage with him not attending camp. The experts on ESPN (and I agree) all said it is the best thing that could happen for Falcon training camp. Mr. Mexico would be in Richmond for most of the week, then back to Atlanta for games once his trial begins. His overall status once the season starts is unknown- suspension/leave of absense more likely than not. They need to get Harrington and the rest of the offense ready by having him take as many first team snaps as possible. Splitting time in training camp with Ookie would hurt the team more than help. The Falcons can now focus on football as much as possible. Of course until Arthur Blank's nuts drop I could care less about the Falcons and how it impacts them.

posted by urall cloolis at 03:30 PM on July 24

I just saw the Atlanta Falcons Press Conference and retract what I previously said about Arthur Blank. Upon reading the indictment he was ready to suspend Vick the maximum amount of 4 games without pay under the collective bargaining agreement. The NFL told him to hold off on action. He is ready to "divorce himself from the player". It seems very unlikely that Vick will ever be in a Falcon jersey again. Hopefully he will never play in the NFL again. I keep hearing about the legal process taking its course. While I agree with that in most cases, this is not most cases. Ookie purchased the property, built it to his specifications, to house sheds used for keeping dogs, built a fence to screen its visibility, has promoted "Bad Newz Kennels", been photographed wearing the gear. Dead dogs found on his property, kept company with the same thugs that were caught trafficking drugs in his car and stole a Rolex from a man in Atlanta airport while travelling with Vick. Lying to the commissioner and his team owner. He is in deep doo-doo and I couldn't be happier about it.

posted by urall cloolis at 04:00 PM on July 24

He is in deep doo-doo and I couldn't be happier about it. As one that's been trying to defend Michael Vick, I have to agree with just about everything you just said, except for that last part. I am so disappointed in what's going on and do hope that all of this is just not true. I am not a Falcons fan but I have enjoyed watching Vick play. He may not have been the prototypical QB but he has been fun to watch. It's just so sad to see an individual with so much talent throw it all away for the sake of the people he considers to be his family or friends. I cannot understand why do professional athletes keep the same company around them knowing full well that they do not have his best interest at heart. I guess it true what the late, great Biggie Smalls once said, "Mo' money, mo' problems".

posted by BornIcon at 08:10 AM on July 25

I couldn't agree more, B.I. I'm not at all happy about Vick's situation because it is ugly and yet another black-eye to the NFL, and athletes in general. He is a great athlete, though, and it's a real tragedy he can't seem to realize how much he's likely throwing away. The money really does become a problem, though, especially with these guys who were probably around this stuff while growing up (before they had any money at all). It's nothing for someone like him to be the big-shot and bankroll this type of endeavor, just like some of the guys he probably thought were all-that while growing up.

posted by dyams at 10:16 AM on July 25

BI- good point. I was just reacting to what Vick did with the dogfighting business. I would actually be much happier if this whole situation never happened, if he never put himself in this situation. I am just glad that he is facing the repurcussions of his very bad choices and it wasn't just glossed over.

posted by urall cloolis at 06:41 PM on July 25

I am just glad that he is facing the repurcussions of his very bad choices and it wasn't just glossed over. Absolutely. Anyone that commits a crime, no matter what their status is in the 'elite' world of celebrities and/or professional athletes, deserves to suffer the same consequences as anyone else that is not part of that world. People are entitled to make mistakes in life but when it leads to someone or something being maliciously murdered, no one should look the other way.

posted by BornIcon at 07:05 AM on July 26

Today Vick entered a not guilty plea. He said that once he is found not guilty he will spend the rest of his life looking for the real dogfighting kingpin.

posted by urall cloolis at 08:43 PM on July 26

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