FanDuel - WFBC

April 11, 2007

Imus, the Irrelevant and Whitlock, the Wise: I know the Imus slur of Rutgers players is all over the news. And, we are sick of hearing about it. But this excellent piece by Jason Whitlock of the Kansas City Star is reminiscent of Bill Cosby's refreshing and candid commentary on the real problems facing minorities.

posted by ChiefsSuperFan to culture at 12:39 PM - 75 comments

Jason Whitlock has no idea what he is talking about. Sharpton and Jesse Jackson have long been outspoken critics of hip hop music. The fact that they aren't given the opportunity to appear on the Today show to talk about those issues hardly means they are avoiding the real problem. This is a ridiculous article, and it makes light of the comments that Imus made. Criticizing these student-athletes because they don't look white enough at the pinnacle of their athletic achievement is not something to take lightly.

posted by bperk at 01:17 PM on April 11

Thanks for the post. Now make this story go away. The whole time I was on the elliptical at the gym yesterday, Headline News was covering this. Not a lot of headlines yesterday, I guess. I feel like saying I agree with this article is wrong because I am white and therefore incapable of perceiving racial truth. And so that's my response to TCS: I don't feel like the divisive sort of posting going on this week fosters any dialogue at all. On preview: bperk, I don't see it. You can't possibly equate railing against Don Imus with a fight for justice, can you?

posted by yerfatma at 01:18 PM on April 11

Wow. Not pulling any punches, I see. Hard not to agree when it's presented thusly, but it almost smacks of a little self-immolation. Whitlock seems to reject the entire modern black pop culture - be it music, sport, leadership... I like hip-hop for the most part. But I would certainly agree that the Imus thing is more revealing for the opportunism it seems to have generated on the leadership side rather than illuminating any genuine racism, or racist agenda. Well, I hate to say it, but - Where's Bishop? That and the worst thing to come from the Imus issue is all the pictures of Imus. Holy crumbly old man. He looks dead - just too busy being a racist dinosaur to notice.

posted by WeedyMcSmokey at 01:22 PM on April 11

Yeah, Imus definitely has a face for radio.

posted by mr_crash_davis at 01:25 PM on April 11

It's kinda ironic...A lot of people wouldn't have even know who the woman's Rutgers team is if not for Imus' remarks. His words brought the team to the forefront whereas they had drifted off into the limelight. That doesn't mitigate what he said. Just an observation. And I agree with yerfatma. Bloody sick of hearing about him (and yet, here I am. Go figure).

posted by jmd82 at 01:25 PM on April 11

On preview: bperk, I don't see it. You can't possibly equate railing against Don Imus with a fight for justice, can you? I think that anytime someone has to face negative consequences because of their bigotry it is a small step in the right direction.

posted by bperk at 01:28 PM on April 11

Well, I hate to say it, but - Where's Bishop? This is exactly what has happened with Sharpton and the media. They like to pick the most vocal (not necessarily most reasoned) black person to be the spokesperson for all of black people. It makes it easier to dismiss his opinion, regardless of how reasonable it may be.

posted by bperk at 01:30 PM on April 11

Some other articles about the Imus controversy other than Whitlock's view. Michael Wilbon Gwen Ifill

posted by bperk at 01:36 PM on April 11

The whole thing makes me sick, but not because I'm hearing about it. It makes me sick that Imus said what he said, and further that he seems on some level genuinely surprised at the outrage. It makes me sick that apparently, more than a few people feel that the outrage is, across the board, manufactured rather than genuine. It makes me sick that the racist part of Imus's comments got plenty of focus -- as it should have -- but that the sexism and misogyny (both in the use of the word "ho" and in the tired old criticism of female athletes for not looking like women are "supposed" to look) have gone almost completely unremarked-upon. When you get right down to it, there really isn't much of anything I've read about this that doesn't make me sick, except for the remarks of Stringer and the players.

posted by lil_brown_bat at 02:22 PM on April 11

Sorry, I don't buy it. Eminem sells plenty of albums to disenfranchised white kids. In fact that's where alot of hip-hop gets sold. Didn't the Beatles glamorize drugs? Didn't the Stones glamorize casual sex? Certainly country music celebrates it own share of gun violence and "thug culture". Who did "I fought the law", "I shot the sherrif", "Cocaine Blues".... Johnny F'ing Cash recorded two albums using in prison concerts. "Early one morning while making the rounds I took a shot of Cocaine and I shot my woman down When right home and I went to bed And I stuck that lovin' .44 beneath my head." Railing against "Hip-Hop" culture and making it a problem for "Black Culture" ignores the fact that alot of music is violent, anti-authoritarian, etc... In ALL cultures. Is the prevalence of Grunge necessarily an indictment of white culture? Black people remember Tupac, white folks remember Kurt Cobain. Just because some Black person somewhere is listening to 50 cent doesn't apologize for anyone being racist. Indeed, Whitlock falls right into that trap by assuming that because these girls are young and black, they listen to "Gansta Rap"... Who's making the racial stereotypes again? I have to guess if this had been a group of blond girls he would just assume they've never listened to Eminem? White America, I could be one of your kids - Check out "White America" by Eminem. (And FYI, I generally can't stand Eminem.) I'm sorry, but saying Hip-Hop is a "black people problem" is at the very least ignorant, and at it's worst, racism. Frankly I find Whitlock's comments alot more offensive than Imus'. At least Imus wasn't trying to be serious. Gee, I listen to Hip Hop, is it OK to call all white people "Whore"? Stereotyping people by race is racism, and that's all I'm seeing here from Mr. Whitlock. The man has the intellectual depth of an Eggplant.

posted by LostInDaJungle at 02:34 PM on April 11

Comparing music (or any art form) to journalism (or people discussing current events on a news channel) is a fool's game. Race doesn't enter into it.

posted by chicobangs at 03:15 PM on April 11

It makes me sick that the racist part of Imus's comments got plenty of focus -- as it should have -- but that the sexism and misogyny (both in the use of the word "ho" and in the tired old criticism of female athletes for not looking like women are "supposed" to look) have gone almost completely unremarked-upon. Good point. This was referenced on PTI and Wilburn (linked to above) dismissed it as "because I'm a man...I focus on the black part not the woman part" or something to that affect. I know that's not exactly what he said, but that's how it came across to me. That to me is just as biased as me saying "I'm white...so I can ignore the 'nappy head' part". Both parts are equally as bad, but racism seems to hit the hotbutton more for some reason (and as you point out...it deserves just as much focus)

posted by bdaddy at 04:15 PM on April 11

They like to pick the most vocal (not necessarily most reasoned) black person to be the spokesperson for all of black people. It makes it easier to dismiss his opinion, regardless of how reasonable it may be. I don't want to assume I know what you're talking about, so I'll ask: are you blaming/crediting the media for inventing and/or promoting Jesse Jackson and/or Al Sharpton as some sort of "spokesperson for all of black people?" Because, if you are, I'll respectfully disagree. Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton seem all too happy to frame themselves as the "spokesperson for all of black people." Put a bottle in front of a boozehound, he'll drink it; put a loaded spike in front of a junkie, he'll use it; put a magnet for racial (and other) controversy in front of the media, they'll plaster it all over every form of media that exists. It's the nature of addiction. The Rev. Jackson and the Rev. Sharpton seem to be addicted to public attention. Even worse, they seem to crave power that they have no right usurping from a community that's already been hurt by outside forces, a community that definitely doesn't need to be marginalized by the behavior of those who purport to help them.

posted by The_Black_Hand at 04:24 PM on April 11

TBH, I like your analogy of the media coverage of race-related issues to an addiction. I had never thought of it like that before, but you are right i think. They feel compelled to cover everything related to the issue. The only problem is some (and i do mean some not all) of these issues are not very significant, and by blowing them up it only serves to keep some of these stereotypes lodged in our minds.

posted by brainofdtrain at 04:29 PM on April 11

I don't want to assume I know what you're talking about, so I'll ask: are you blaming/crediting the media for inventing and/or promoting Jesse Jackson and/or Al Sharpton as some sort of "spokesperson for all of black people?" Because, if you are, I'll respectfully disagree. Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton seem all too happy to frame themselves as the "spokesperson for all of black people." I guess I am. They do think they are the voice of black people, I just think the media is irresponsible for acting like they really are. They both have serious credibility issues, yet they are often the first and only stop on the what-black-people-think tour.

posted by bperk at 05:03 PM on April 11

In a new development, MSNBC drops the simulcast of the Imus show.

posted by bperk at 05:35 PM on April 11

Hip-hop music is far from the problem. If your radio and or cd player is raising your children; check the mirror. As for the comments made; waaaaay to muuuch aiiiiirrrrr tiiimme for a comment that ignorant. Can we move on. He's suspended (alot that going on lately), apologized, and lost to big sponsors; I don't think they still tar and feather or cut tongues out. (Hey there's a thought) Yeah, Yeah, thats it out with his tongue.

posted by fourthreeforty at 05:58 PM on April 11

In a new development, MSNBC drops the simulcast of the Imus show. I'd been hoping for some nationally-broadcasted infomercials in the morning.

posted by yerfatma at 06:04 PM on April 11

People who immediately summon Jackson or Sharpton, when they feel like they have offended Black people, don't realize that running to these figures is just as offensive. They are not the Pope's of the Black race. "uht oh, I said the "N" word, I better call Jesse and AL to let "their" people know I didn't mean it (or really they didn't know the mic was on). This is not to demean the positive work that both men have done as activists (and they both have done positive things). But when someone runs to them to quickly show "they like Blacks", only further shows the disconnect they have with the race all together. Why not write the local black congressman or woman. Why not summon Colin Powell or Condoleeza Rice. Oh, you forgot these 2 were black because they're not always preaching at a church or leading some march? Why not call Louis Farrakhan? Because inside you feel like what you said actually refers to Black people like him? If you want to "make up" for something that you think offended the Black race, here's a hint. Man the hell up and admit you don't give a fuck. Don't further disrespect us by doing some dumb shit to save your own ass. What? You think we don't know you have certain prejudices against us? apologized, and lost to big sponsors; I don't think they still tar and feather or cut tongues out. (Hey there's a thought) Yeah, Yeah, thats it out with his tongue. No, I say we make him get up every morning and go to work for free. And while we're at it, have a Black woman from the Rutgers team come up with a dress code for his ass. Then have another woman (of any race) come up with a new "personal conduct policy" that is bigot ass has to follow every day. How about that. Then let's randomly piss test him and make the results public. You know his old ass is on something. Then let's ban that damn "gang member" bandanna and cowboy hat he wears. God forbid he be allowed to show his southern culture or heritage. NBC shouldn't allow him to look like a country western singer, all they sing about is booze and getting arrested right? I'm not going to far am I?

posted by Bishop at 06:19 PM on April 11

Then let's randomly piss test him and make the results public. You know his old ass is on something. You obviously haven't suffered through his (and his wife's) rants about healthy living.

posted by yerfatma at 06:36 PM on April 11

I've never liked Imus, and have always struggled to explain his popularity. He has a face that's tailor-made for radio, talks like he's got marbles in his mouth, and really isn't that humorous. His apologies after his comments were pointless and merely an attempt to save his own ass. If he gets axed for good, who really cares. The next idiot out to get ratings will jump into his place. While I agree you can't equate music and other entertainment genres to journalism, there still needs to be some serious thought put into this issue by artists who, unfortunately, are the ones many people pay the most attention to. It seems as if calling women bitches, hoes, whatever, is fine as long as it's nameless individuals on the TV screen. When it's aimed at actual people, such as a basketball team, then it's seen as horribly unacceptable. But it can't go both ways, because many individuals remain far too narrow-minded to make any distinction between art and reality. And if it's all about making money with whatever is being pedaled, then the guilty individuals need to step forward and let everyone know they just-plain don't care. Blow it off as being protected by the giant blanket known as "Freedom of Speech" and then all's fair.

posted by dyams at 09:24 PM on April 11

Don't blame Imus for this circus blame the media with Sharpton parading along next to the elephant. This remark by Imus never should have gotten any media attention. Everyone everday will say something that will be considered offensive to someone else, however they won't admit it, apologize for it, or lose their job over it. If Sharpton wants to be a leader he should be in front of the apology line. Sharpton was the ring master of the Brawley hoax 20 years ago accusing up to six white men of raping a 15 year old girl. Sharpton also accused a local prosecuter of kidnapping and raping Brawley on 33 separate occasions. The hoax began to unraveled when a security guard for Brawley's lawyers testified that the lawyers and Sharpton knew that Brawley was lying. Sharpton was ordered to pay damages to the accused local prosecuter. This clown has never offered an apology to the accused or to the public for his hoax. Sharpton was probably on the bandwagon accusing Duke players of rape which never had any credible evidence. He should apologize for that as well. I don't listen to Imus but if he had the backbone to stand up to Sharpton then maybe he would have something worth listening to.

posted by longgreenline at 01:51 AM on April 12

Sharpton and Jackson are hypocrites. Does anyone recall Jackson using the racial term HymieTown in reference to NYC while he last ran for President of the U.S.? Hymie is a racial slur for people of Jewish decent. I don't recall anyone picketing his campaign or calling for him to withdraw from the election race, or him being blasted in the media, etc. What Imus said was terrible, however, racism is a two-way street in this country.

posted by FonGu at 04:55 AM on April 12

Don't blame Imus for this circus blame the media with Sharpton parading along next to the elephant. This remark by Imus never should have gotten any media attention. I don't see that. People need to be called on their actions, regardless of who points out their error.

posted by yerfatma at 06:02 AM on April 12

That's a good take, SummersEve. Frankly, the moral outrage the people on TV and radio and in print were expressing seemed opportunistic to me ... but I guess that's what they are getting paid to do. Put out an opinion. I think the best possible thing that can happen next Tuesday is for those young women to meet with Imus, hear his apology, and tell no one what happened. Don't tell us they forgave him. Or told him off. Or even that it wasn't that big a deal. Just say nothing. It would be like taking oxygen away from a flame.

posted by forrestv at 06:05 AM on April 12

Iím no Don Imus apologist. He and his tiny companion Mike Lupica blasted me after I fell out with ESPN. I used to like Jason Whitlock and respected what he had to say but now he just sounds like he found a platform to blast Mike Lupica and ESPN. He's just disgruntled that he's no longer part of the "Worldwide Leader of Sports" family and this is a way of sending that message. What did the whole Don Imus thing have to do with Mike Lupica and ESPN? Nada, zip, zero, zilch but he still found a way to toss them in the same bunch with Don Imus like ESPN sponsors him. What a shame. He made some valid points but as soon as I saw that he put Lupica and ESPN alongside Imus, he lost me. IMO, the difference between rap (not hip-hop) and what Don Imus does is in his morning show are two different things because Imus is being broadcasted Live while the music is censored and to purchase the product, a person must be at least 18. One is music/entertainment while the other is more of a political standpoint where the guests are respected individuals dealing with politics, more or less. Who listens to rap and who listens to Don Imus' show? There's your answer~

posted by BornIcon at 06:52 AM on April 12

who listens to Don Imus' show? Actually, I've wondered this quite a bit over the past few years, but not in the context you're thinking.

posted by SummersEve at 07:20 AM on April 12

I'm not really of the opinion that this has gotten too much attention. I don't ever recall hearing anything on a channel like MSNBC that was this racist and sexist. I think the problem is that a lot of people hear the word racist and immediately assume that the politically correct police are patrolling. Perhaps as a result, they were unwilling to take a look and realize how shockingly racist his statements were.

posted by bperk at 07:31 AM on April 12

Hmm. Lot of good comments to ponder over this AM. A lot of comments have to do with the "media circus", attention-seekers, and so on. In fact, as we read the article that SummersEve linked to, we see that popular phenomenon of the media devouring itself, playing the "the media sucks!" game. Gee, I wonder why they're doing that. Ten percent genuine desire for journalistic integrity, ninety percent bandwagon-jumping in search of their own follow-along crowd of head-nodders saying, "Wow, yeah, this guy tells it like it is"? My take on it is that what's going on now isn't all just flap and hype and a desire for ratings or self-promotion. Somewhere in all this -- and they're not that hard to find, if you take the trouble to listen and apply a little critical thinking -- are voices that have been crying in the wilderness about these very issues for years, for decades, and have been dismissed and ignored. If they use the current incident as a springboard to try to get their point across, is that opportunistic? Of course it is -- but is that a bad thing? I'm not so sure. People who fight worthy but unpopular battles are at a disadvantage from the start; if they are to make progress, they can't afford to fight only the long-odds fights, when the opponent is rested and ready and has the whole world behind him. Imus has run roughshod over many individuals and groups over the years, and his no-neck audience has screeched idiot laughter at his targets without having any interest in questioning the truth of what he says. Now people are listening to his detractors, and at least some are questioning the acceptability of his actions and thinking about where "free speech" ends and a civil society begins. As for the "I blame hip-hop" line of reasoning...well, let that play out, but I don't see that as a threat to undermine the real issues here, or to provide a bigger target for Imus to hide behind. Imus's choice of words may have come from hip-hop, but if you took the phrase "nappy-headed hos" out of his vocabulary, do you really think he wouldn't have come up with other words to say what he was thinking? There are a lot of acts that need cleaning up, but I do have hope that this will be one case where pointing out your neighbor's dirty laundry won't excuse your own stinky drawers. Lastly, I can't say enough how proud I am, as a woman who's loved sports all my life and been denied opportunities because of my gender, of the conduct of Coach Stringer and the Rutgers team. They provided the most eloquent possible rebuttal to any of the sneers that Imus or anyone else might send their way. I hope that this incident provides them with life-long strength, as they can always remember a time when they said, with dignity and conviction, "I am a person of worth." (on preview: what bperk said)

posted by lil_brown_bat at 07:39 AM on April 12

Thank you so much llb for expressing so eloquently what I was writing. Then I read your post. I agree wholeheartedly with you. "Stinky drawers" ROFL

posted by yzelda4045 at 08:02 AM on April 12

Not to stir up how blacks and white are not treated equally....and get Bishop all bent out of shape again BUT Where is the thread today about how the Duke lacross team that many of you wanted to hang without trial last year was found completely innocent of all charges. Those were white guys wrongly accused(just like pacman)

posted by Debo270 at 11:36 AM on April 12

Having once been a minority of two in a school, I know what it is to be different and be teased and picked on and taunted. When I decided that what those kind of people say tells more about their own inadequacies than mine, and that I was ok.... to myself at least, the teasing and taunts stopped. Lesson, respect yourself and others will also.. And who cares what anyone else says. (Purposeful criticism is always valid.... and should be considered as honestly delivered.... but we are talking about something else here). Piscator

posted by Fly_Piscator at 11:46 AM on April 12

I don't see that. People need to be called on their actions, regardless of who points out their error hypocritical? No one on the Internet is reading a 1,000 word screed, and they definitely aren't reading a dozen of them. So whale away, but realize it's become an echo chamber. -yerfatma (after reading all of my 1,000 word screeds). footnote: notice the length of some of the posts here, then notice the responses from every one except yourself.

posted by Bishop at 11:55 AM on April 12

Where is the thread today about how the Duke lacross team that many of you wanted to hang without trial last year was found completely innocent of all charges. Like I said in another post, I actually posted that story early this morning but our SpoFi moderator decided to delete it for whatever reason. That's a story that I wanted to talk about but I guess he felt otherwise.

posted by BornIcon at 12:23 PM on April 12

Where is the thread today about how the Duke lacross team that many of you wanted to hang without trial last year was found completely innocent of all charges. Those were white guys wrongly accused(just like pacman) I don't know, why didn't you start it? As well ask why this thread didn't show up until yesterday.

posted by lil_brown_bat at 12:32 PM on April 12

Imus is getting just desserts for all the other times he's made ugly remarks (and for all the mainstream journalists who spent their mornings kissing his ass). The thing that offended me most about this incident is that Imus took on an obscure and powerless subject -- a women's college basketball team who just hit the pinnacle of their sport and don't deserve to be the butt of ridicule. Now we'll all remember them for being called an ugly name by an imbecilic octogenarian. If Imus had turned his skewering sense of humor on a powerful subject, I'd cut him more slack.

posted by rcade at 12:39 PM on April 12

Like I said in another post, I actually posted that story early this morning but our SpoFi moderator decided to delete it for whatever reason. That's a story that I wanted to talk about but I guess he felt otherwise. Glad to know someone tried? don't know, why didn't you start it? As well ask why this thread didn't show up until yesterday. Cause honestly I never have and am not sure how too. I suck.

posted by Debo270 at 12:45 PM on April 12

Don't beat yourself up Debo, it's cool~ I think I'm pretty computer savvy but it took me a minute to figure it out for myself as far as posting a story goes. It's not that hard, really but I'm sure you'll figure it out eventually. My question is why was my post on the Duke lacrosse team deleted? It's a fair question that I feel deseves an explanation. It's a story most of us would like to discuss. At least I know I do~

posted by BornIcon at 01:14 PM on April 12

I want to know too why it wasn't posted too. I guess who ever is in charge was scared of where it would go. Its the man keeping us down. Born Icon, thanks for the confidence booster. I never really looked into doing it because the great people that are usually here have their finger on the pulse and always have all the topics i want to discuss already down.

posted by Debo270 at 01:39 PM on April 12

-yerfatma (after reading all of my 1,000 word screeds). Sorry. Long before you ever came along I developed adult-onset ADD. Any comment that scrolls on a 1600x1200 monitor causes me to scroll past. Brevity being the soul of something or other.

posted by yerfatma at 01:44 PM on April 12

Not a problem Debo anytime...but I wouldn't go as far as to say, "Its the man keeping us down" but I did find that to be funny as hell. I just wanted to post that story not to see where it would go but because after nearly a year of being put thru hell, these kids were finally vindicated of all these false allegations and regardless of the color of their skin, they were mistreated unfairly targeted and no matter what was going on, they always proclaimed their innocence. This just shows you what a person with a little bit of power can do if that power is in the hands of someone with an agenda. I just wonder if they're celebrating by hiring strippers...........ok, my bad~

posted by BornIcon at 01:46 PM on April 12

Any Duke stories involving the rape accussations have been being deleted for a long time now. The very first link didn't get that bad, but when the next update was posted it got really ugly. I tried to find it in the archives, but to no success. If I remember correctly, the last reason given about deleting those posts was that it had moved on past the sports realm a long time ago.

posted by MrFrisby at 01:47 PM on April 12

But it's a current event right now with the case being dropped and I think we deserve the benefit of the doubt of being adult enough to discuss this....wait, I almost forgot where I was posting this. Nevermind~

posted by BornIcon at 01:56 PM on April 12

I think we deserve the benefit of the doubt of being adult enough to discuss this....wait, I almost forgot where I was posting this. Nevermind~ BornIcon, before you really get carried away with the snide remarks, what exactly were you linking to? It's not always the content; sometimes it's the source (for example, if you linked to Yahoo). Don't be so quick to assume why it got torpedoed -- it could be something fairly innocuous. (and, btw, discussions of SpoFi policy really should take place in the Locker Room, so if you want to pursue this rather than hijacking this thread, that would be the place to do it)

posted by lil_brown_bat at 02:17 PM on April 12

Where is the thread today about how the Duke lacross team that many of you wanted to hang without trial last year was found completely innocent of all charges. Those were white guys wrongly accused(just like pacman) With all due respect, Debo, I don't see the similarity just yet. After months and months of investigations, the Duke lacrosse players were cleared. If, in 8-10 months (or however long it may take), Adam Jones is cleared of all charges, then I'd see a clear similarity. Maybe splitting hairs, maybe not. I'm just sayin'.

posted by The_Black_Hand at 04:06 PM on April 12

With all due respect, Debo, I don't see the similarity just yet. After months and months of investigations, the Duke lacrosse players were cleared. If, in 8-10 months (or however long it may take), Adam Jones is cleared of all charges, then I'd see a clear similarity. I'm not sure I'll see any similarity (or connection) between the situations involving either Duke lacrosse players or Pacman Jones and the Rutgers women's basketball team no matter how many months I wait.

posted by lil_brown_bat at 04:19 PM on April 12

Gary and I are revisiting the issue of whether the dropping of the charges against the Duke athletes should be posted here. If it had never been covered here at all, I'd be happy to avoid it entirely. But we did entertain quite a bit of discussion when the charges were fresh and being pursued by Johnny Law.

posted by rcade at 04:20 PM on April 12

With all due respect, Debo, I don't see the similarity just yet. After months and months of investigations, the Duke lacrosse players were cleared. If, in 8-10 months (or however long it may take), Adam Jones is cleared of all charges, then I'd see a clear similarity. TBH, there is some similarity. The lacrosse players were suspended from Duke upon their indictment. It was only after the charges appeared more and more shaky that Duke allowed them to come back. This is rather similar to what happened in Jones's case, except there was a consistent pattern of behavior that led to his suspension.

posted by Howard_T at 04:33 PM on April 12

OK, CBS has now canned the old white guy so we can put him to rest and hopefully the black community will use this open dialogue (excessive publicity) to take on their biggest threat - the gangsta rappers, "street cred" athletes, and thug drug dealers as role models. Kids should be encouraged to admire and emulate people like Colin Powell, Condi, Shaq, the Williams sisters, Tiki Barber (to name a few celebs), and many nameless others that exist in every community. Then Imus could take the short walk to his grave having [unknowingly] done a great service to the black community.

posted by 1959Giants at 05:20 PM on April 12

For starters, the Duke thread is sitting in between the Michael Vick "vindication" thread for NOT being in possession of weed, and the thread about the Vikings players on the boat, who basically did the same thing the Duke players did (hire women to come do things at a party that they shouldn't have been doing.) Again notice there is a call for vindication concerning some kids who basically pulled a pacman jones by having a party with a few under age kids, beer, undoubtedly drugs, and strippers. But because they were falsely accused of rape note how the previous is being totally ignored and there is a call for a Spofi thread to proclaim them innocent. Innocent of rape? Obviously. Innocent of what NFL and NBA players get a verbal thrashing for here at Spofi twice a month? No chance. hopefully the black community will use this open dialogue (excessive publicity) to take on their biggest threat - the gangsta rappers, "street cred" athletes, and thug drug dealers as role models. Since your such an expert on the Black community, I'll have you know that twice as many eminem wanna be's (your son, nephew, daughters boyfriend included) are out there trying their hardest to get what they think is "street cred". And trust me, people like Imus are a far bigger threat to the Black community than the stereo-typical BS you listed. To avoid the things you listed just requires proper home training. No amount of home training will help the Black community avoid people like Don Imus. We just have to learn to live with it.

posted by Bishop at 06:21 PM on April 12

To avoid the things you listed just requires proper home training. No amount of home training will help the Black community avoid people like Don Imus. We just have to learn to live with it. Thanks for making the all-important point: it begins at home and is rooted there. Avoiding Don Imus is easy, just tune him out and not all that many people have tuned him in. Much harder to avoid your family.

posted by 1959Giants at 07:19 PM on April 12

An ESPN article on the firing, with some interesting statements by CBS president Leslie Moonves, also says that a possible replacement for Imus's slot is Mike and the Mad Dog. Wow, that'll be a big improvement. Unless I'm completely misremembering, in that piece de resistance of sportswriting The Greatest 100 Sports Arguments of All Time, Chris "Mad Dog" Russo opined with considerable invective that women's hoops is the dumbest thing since dog sweaters. Think maybe I'll write Mr. Moonves a letter...

posted by lil_brown_bat at 08:51 PM on April 12

Avoiding Don Imus is easy, just tune him out and not all that many people have tuned him in. I'm sure the Rutgers team was listening when he made his comments. Do you have any idea how many people listen(ed) to that guy?

posted by Bishop at 03:55 AM on April 13

Howard, my bad, I didn't clarify, I was just referring to the Duke players being exonerated, and applying that to what happens if Jones is eventually exonerated. As far as the suspensions, though, I certainly understand your point.

posted by The_Black_Hand at 05:33 AM on April 13

I'm sure the Rutgers team was listening when he made his comments I'd be quite willing to bet that no Rutgers players were tuned into Imus when he made those comments but they sure heard about them when the media frenzy began. Imus is history now, we can only hope that all leaders take this dialogue opportunity to squelch all sources of bigotry and ignorance.

posted by 1959Giants at 05:45 AM on April 13

Chris "Mad Dog" Russo opined with considerable invective that women's hoops is the dumbest thing since dog sweaters And what's the problem with that opinion? It's not like he called anyone a degrading name or made a racist remark, he gave his opinion about women's basketball and from the ratings for the WNBA, he's got a point.

posted by BornIcon at 06:00 AM on April 13

The best thing about them is that they won't ever be accused of encouraging any enlightened discussions.

posted by bperk at 07:09 AM on April 13

Imus is a jackass and a talentless jackass who speaks with marbles in his mouth at that.

posted by urall cloolis at 07:16 AM on April 13

Random prediction: Imus gets picked up by one of the satellite radio companies and another nail gets driven into the coffin of terrestrial radio.

posted by SummersEve at 07:20 AM on April 13

And what's the problem with that opinion? If you have to ask that question, BornIcon, you'll probably never know. But if you're interested in figuring it out, context is your friend. So's critical reading. The Mad Dog is a sexist pig; replacing Imus with the Mad Dog over this incident would be a slap in the face.

posted by lil_brown_bat at 07:31 AM on April 13

I don't listen to Mike and the Mad Dog but I'm all for the freedom of speech LBB. If he would've said something degrading or anything racist like what Don Imus said concerning women's basketball, that's one thing but he just gave his opinion about the sport that he thinks it's "dumb", so what?!? Did he offend you by what he said? Do you listen to his show at all? I find soccer to be dumb so I don't watch it but that's just my opinion. It doesn't mean that anyone else shouldn't watch it, I just don't.

posted by BornIcon at 07:42 AM on April 13

Freedom of speech has nothing to do with someone who has a radio show. That protection is limited to the government limiting speech. I don't buy that if you don't like it, don't listen to it argument. There are plenty of things that people should not be given a forum to say. Sure, they can say it legally, but there is no reason it has to be broadcast over the airwaves to millions of people. I'd bet that all but the most libertarian of people would have limits. The fact that they trot out free speech as an excuse for those spewing racist or sexist garbage is probably more of an indication that those particular comments don't really offend them.

posted by bperk at 08:02 AM on April 13

Freedom of speech has nothing to do with someone who has a radio show I'm sorry but WHAT?!!? Freedom of speech has everything to do with radio and this guy said nothing sexist or racist, he gave his opinion about women's basketball. You, and I'm sure other people will agree that maybe he's wrong about women's basketball but I'm only speaking for myself and I just wasn't offended~

posted by BornIcon at 08:27 AM on April 13

No, it doesn't. The freedom of speech is something that is given to us in the Bill of Rights, and is solely a limit on what the government can do. It has absolute no relevance to a radio personality working for a company broadcasting on the radio. None. They can't be arrested for broadcasting a certain view, but they can certainly have their broadcasting privileges taken away. "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances."

posted by bperk at 08:50 AM on April 13

So your saying that radio personalities don't have a freedom of speech to express their opinions even if it's not sexist or racist? If you don't agree with someone's comments or views and there's nothing controversial about it, they don't have the right to express that? I don't know what radio shows you listen to but most radio shows that I listen to express their opinions thru-out the whole show.

posted by BornIcon at 08:57 AM on April 13

If you don't agree with someone's comments or views and there's nothing controversial about it, they don't have the right to express that? It's not about what I agree with: it's about what the radio station, the media syndicate, and all the advertisers involved agree with. If I piss off any of them to a strong enough degree, I'm gone. You'll notice that CBS only dropped Imus when all the sponsors started pulling their ads from his show.

posted by DrJohnEvans at 09:01 AM on April 13

You'll notice that CBS only dropped Imus when all the sponsors started pulling their ads from his show You have a point. It is about the almighty dollar and you made a valid point~

posted by BornIcon at 09:11 AM on April 13

Random prediction: Imus gets picked up by one of the satellite radio companies and another nail gets driven into the coffin of terrestrial radio. Random reaction: You're out of your mind. Satellite radio is dead unless they clean up their financial house. Satellite radio reaches 14 million people a day (if you belive their figures, which have been artificially inflated since their inception); terrestrial radio reaches 4 billion plus a day. Terrestrial radio isn't going anywhere. Stern couldn't do it, Opie and Anthony couldn't do it, and Imus sure the hell won't do it.

posted by The_Black_Hand at 09:33 AM on April 13

But that doesn't mean that he won't be picked up by some satellite show where everything is uncensored. Terrestrial radio reaches "4 billion plus a day" (is that right?) because it's free. I have Sirius in my car and love it but when I'm at work, I listen to one regular radio show (ESPNRadio.com) and that's online~

posted by BornIcon at 09:43 AM on April 13

TBH, I mentioned that prediction to someone I work with. He said he was thinking the same thing, with a twist. Satellite radio will over-estimate him and he'll just speed the sinkin'. I think that makes more sense than my prediction.

posted by SummersEve at 10:38 AM on April 13

Freedom of speech has everything to do with radio and this guy said nothing sexist or racist Radio is a business; freedom of speech doesn't enter into it. All the first amendment guarantees is that you cannot be put in jail for stating an opinion - that's it. If a radio host insults his bosses, insults the audience to the extend that they rise up in protest, violates obscenity restrictions that force the station to pay fines, or just bores the audience to tears by droning on and on, he can be removed from his job. There is no such thing as a constitutionally protected right to a radio show.

posted by Venicemenace at 11:42 AM on April 13

I'm not so sure satellite radio will pick up Imus; Sirius and XM want that merger to go through. You'll always have freedom of speech on the radio until your sponsors decide freedom is too expensive.

posted by Newbie Walker at 12:51 PM on April 13

I get satellite radio so I don't have to listen to a bunch of jackasses babbling, like Stern, Opie and Anthony, Oprah's stupid friend Gayle, etc. It's all about music without annoying commercials and advertisements (and also being able to hear all major league baseball games in crystal-clear, no-static broadcasts).

posted by dyams at 04:55 PM on April 13

Paul R. La Monica of CNNMoney doesn't see Imus as a good fit for satellite radio during the merger attempt.

posted by The Crafty Sousepaw at 05:27 PM on April 13

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