The Swastikadome: In which sharp-eyed, clear-headed, and entirely rational citizens spot the Nazi emblem hidden in the Metrodome by devious German architects. Can American democracy survive two decades of Nazi propaganda at Twins and Vikings games?
posted by cobra! to other at 11:09 AM - 64 comments
Ha! That's a riot. My favorite part is where the firm in charge of building the dome should "pay for their crimes". I couldn't entirely tell if they were serious or not, though. In case you didn't know, The Swastika is originally from India, and is still very common over there. It's a good-luck symbol, among other things. I still have a couple of packs of swastika matches from Karnataka. If you already knew that, I apologize for being a pedantic jerk. I like the fact that a symbol so reviled in some parts of the world can be so revered in others. A perfect solution to this whole problem would be to just explain the origin of the swastika to the good people of Minneapolis, and then rename the Vikings to The Fighting Hindus.
posted by Samsonov14 at 12:15 PM on May 16
I am not sure if I am supposed to laugh at this or what. They aren't serious, are they?
posted by stofer71 at 12:28 PM on May 16
Ha, if only Ralph Engelstad would have known of this...I'm sure his nazi ass would have put one on the roof of the Ralph Engelstad Arena in Grand Forks... The only crime against humanity that happened in the Dome, that I can think of, was Ron Davis' pitching...
posted by chris2sy at 12:59 PM on May 16
That Engelstad article is, um, quite a piece of journalism.
posted by cobra! at 01:10 PM on May 16
Oh, my goodness, I definitely don't believe I should have read that Engelstad article at work. I feel dirty just having read it. How very clever to use such a tragedy as the Holocaust as a way to get a new & very ugly stadium.
posted by bperk at 01:41 PM on May 16
Maybe I should have picked a different source than the National Vanguard's love letter to Ralph Engelstad...sorry. He always claimed he wasn't a nazi, etc., but with friend's like that...
posted by chris2sy at 01:45 PM on May 16
I can't figure out which one is giving me the giggles more: The Swastika Dome (which is absolutely its name now), or the asphalt sweat-stain that's being worshipped in Chicago. How a clever use of shame can help build a new ballpark. Dignity must be a cheap commodity.
posted by WeedyMcSmokey at 02:56 PM on May 16
the roof should be fixed and each team should get their OWN seperate stadium. both teams are good enough that they would get good attendance in new stadiums and no baseball teams that share a stadium with football teams get any attendance because the stadiums are atrocious. The metrodome is forever known as the swastikadome and anybody responsible for the disgraceful act should be heavily fined and or imprisoned and have all their business cut off until they offer a suitable apology/excuse and build the roofs on all minny's new stadiums for free or at a discount. May the idiots who made the roof burn in hell with hitler
posted by you'reallwrong at 03:10 PM on May 16
Sharp-eyed people can also spot the "More Bars in More Places" symbolism of Cingular/AT&T's latest media campaign. This will surely spark debate into the reach and impact of Ma Bell two decades after the breakup of that institution.
posted by johnnyfish at 03:17 PM on May 16
Well, I was kinda wondering if the article was in-fact some sort satirical piece by The Onion. Presuming that it is factual and not a joke, I was disturbed to read that "HHH Metrodome roof was designed by Nazi, Horst Berger who was born in Germany in 1925." Is Berger a Nazi...? If so, then what is he doing in the United States? (Ooops, almost forgot Werner von Braun...was the Apollo 11 moon-landing a "Nazi" success story?? Just askin'.) But what is a Nazi? What is a war criminal? If Berger was a card-carrying member of the National Socialist Party in the Weimar Republic any time between 1928-1945, then obviously, he is a Nazi. If he was a member of Hitler Youth, that's a grey area. If he was a foot soldier of the Wehrmacht, then *maybe* but not certainly. Of course, it's all too easy to say -- as the N.American news media always does -- that any teutonic-blooded white boy who lived in Hitler's Germany was a Nazi, even if he was a pig-farmer "just following ze orders." But where does that leave someone who wasn't following orders, but instead CHOSE to work closely with Nazis for sheer motive of financial reward -- someone like Prescott Bush -- let's be real, the millions he paid in fines to the U.S. government for violating the Trading With the Enemy Act in 1942 wasn't for jaywalking or spitting on the sidewalk -- does that qualify Grampa as a Nazi? (But I digress...). I did a quick google search on Horst Berger -- it says he graduated university in 1954 as a 29 year old, I see that he has been named by Engineering News Record as "one of the top 3 structural engineers in the past 125 years," but I see nothing about his Nazi past. Maybe it's possible he was a Nazi (he was all of 8 years old when Kristallnacht went down), and it would be interesting to peruse Mr. Berger's other design work and play "Where's Waldo" with the Swastika. Maybe he's a sympathizer, but I don't know. I do, however, see a lot of conclusions being jumped at. Obviously, this is attracting a lot of negative publicity, and the swastika should probably get covered up, if only so easily-distracted people can focus on some real news. There's a town in north Ontario (and no, Neil Young didn't sing about it) near Kirkton Lake, called Swastika, and they don't have a problem with people thinking they're a bunch of Nazis.
posted by the red terror at 03:24 PM on May 16
Damn, I was going to change my handle to "you'reallwrong" but some newbie who sees the Virgin Mary in Olympic Stadium (what else are they going to use that stadium for?) beat me to it.
posted by jasonspaceman at 03:25 PM on May 16
Golden Palace paid a shitload of money for a piece of toast with an image of the Virgin Mary on it. And Bernard Hopkins wore a Golden Palace tattoo on his back for a championship fight against Felix Trinidad. (Or was Hopkins' tattoo of the Virgin Mary? Maybe the blood on Trinidad's face was really stigmata?)
posted by the red terror at 03:57 PM on May 16
Well, there's an idea, have the Golden Palace buy the swastikadome and all will be well.
posted by jasonspaceman at 04:05 PM on May 16
the red terror, good thought provoking comments
posted by vito90 at 04:48 PM on May 16
Just on the comments regarding the Hindu swastika - the arms are bent counter-clockwise, while the Nazi ones are clockwise. Try drawing them and see the difference. Unfortunately for the Minnesotans, they ended up with the Nazi one.
posted by owlhouse at 05:20 PM on May 16
Yeah, but wasn't Hitler copying (if erroneously) the Hindu swastika, with his whole dumbass "Aryan" pseudo-history?
posted by lil_brown_bat at 06:38 PM on May 16
OK...I want all jews to sell their Benz' and Volkswagens and never wear red and black again. Don't be a hypocrit...you can't have it both ways. That's a little tongue-in-cheek, btw. My wife is Jewish and is the most beautiful person...inside and out...I've ever known. Why she married me with such a warped sense of humor, I have no idea.
posted by Texan_lost_in_NY at 06:53 PM on May 16
here's a bit on the history of the swastika.
posted by goddam at 07:59 PM on May 16
Interesting comments and links. Pre War Nazi Germany was a very intresting place, Esepcially for young Scientists like Werner Von Braun. They, in most cases, embraced the Nazi party because they were encouraged to explore new technology. The scientists recieved funding for projects that couldnt be funded by other means. Hitler was very interested in technology. Young Tech-types were impressed by his future plans for Germany. Many were then caught in a gigantic Catch 22. when the War started. Von Braun could be linked to forced labor and other terrible things that is very true. Many like him, emerged from WWII and were able to see the errors of their ways. What a lot of people today over look is that under Nazi control, in the Thritys, many Germans saw economic progress. The country moved forward. When people have jobs and arent hungry, they tend to over look alot of things. If you every have the time look into the life of Albert Speer. It really sheds light into whole image of Germany.
posted by daddisamm at 12:28 AM on May 17
"But where does that leave someone who wasn't following orders, but instead CHOSE to work closely with Nazis...?" Ummm... you get to be Pope, don't you?
posted by JJ at 04:45 AM on May 17
all I can say is that is clever. If the Jews or anyone else couldn't see what was being built right before their eyes, then once again they have been duped. Maybe God is not happy with the Jews.
posted by bluekarma at 10:20 AM on May 17
Maybe God is not happy with the Jews. "Are you a fuckhead?"
posted by lil_brown_bat at 10:55 AM on May 17
"What a lot of people today over look is that under Nazi control, in the Thritys, many Germans saw economic progress. The country moved forward. When people have jobs and arent hungry, they tend to over look alot of things." Substitute 21st century for "Thirtys" and America for "Germans" and the more things change, the more they stay the same. Politicians do a con-job getting your neighbors and friends to rush off to a meat-grinder in the desert, and the public would rather think about the Survivor and Apprentice finales. Bread and circuses ... as it was in the Old Rome, so it is in the New Rome.
posted by the red terror at 04:22 PM on May 17
"Maybe God is not happy with the Jews." That is as nasty and odious a thought as I have seen on this forum. Sadly, it's the sort of prevailing moronic post hoc rationale that's all too frequent today. It's the sort of ignorance we expect from the mindset of self-proclaimed compassionate conservative "theologians" such as Pat Robertson and Jerry Falwell who said the 9/11 atrocity was God's retribution for America's sodomite homosexuals and secular liberals.
posted by the red terror at 04:36 PM on May 17
Well said, red terror.
posted by Texan_lost_in_NY at 04:48 PM on May 17
Sooner or later you were going to bring the Theologians. Blame it on the christains They are the Nazi's of today! They hate eveybody, all in the of Jesus Christ.. The BooB Bush is the nastiest of them all! He lies about everything. He even over looks the fact that he was a druggie at one point......Yes all of our troubles today can be blamed on the Christains/republicans---especially those "born again ones" Good grief, I am starting to sound as silly as some of you! Nazi Germany was a very bad thing. Hopefully we have learned from it over the years.. I am getting sick and tired of you folks who keep bringing religion into some of these issues. What is so scary about a Christain? Answer that from your own head-not from some thread written by some idiot on the internet. To think all of this started with a Swasiska in the Metro dome! And to think we got to sending our neighbors to a meat grinder. I had better quit ranting now, or some of you old timers will start throwing around words I dont understand! Us newbes are stupid! Have a great day! I am going to Watch the Twins on TV. They are playing in the dreaded dome! They are even playing the Team that W used to own.......wow
posted by daddisamm at 06:02 PM on May 17
Well, since this whole discussion started with an example of Godwin's Law, we had to talk about something else. So Bush and Christians it is, I guess. I'm pretty sure that if a discussion starts with Nazis, sooner or later Bush and Fundamentalist Christians will be invoked. Don't take the Christian-bashing too personally, daddisamm. It's only the internet, and we're all the victim of a nerdly pile-on at some point or another.
posted by Samsonov14 at 06:24 PM on May 17
What is so scary about a Christain? Well, since you asked, I guess I'll stick with what I already wrote -- namely, the sicko pathological faith-based garbage that spews out of the mouths of idiots like Pat Robertson and Jerry Falwell. Tell me: do you agree with their pious Christian views that the 911 attack was God's retribution against homos and pro-choicers? Or do you think, y'know, maybe it's more likely that some terrorists deliberately hijacked some airplanes and crashed them into buildings? Is it the Christian faith-based view you believe? Or the secular reality-based view the rest of us saw on our televisions? And please: Try to answer that from your own head - not from some thread written by some idiot on the internet.
posted by the red terror at 06:26 PM on May 17
I stand by my remark: "Maybe God is not happy with the Jews." As a christian, we know the Jews rejected the messiah Jesus Christ and the persecution they have suffered thru time is a result of Gods displeasure with them. It's that simple. I don't have to be a blind sheep lackey because I can form my own opinions based my personal religous beliefs and not some PC agenda. It isn't always about Jewish people. Others have suffered as much or more. Get over it.
posted by bluekarma at 06:29 PM on May 17
As a christian, we know the Jews rejected the messiah Jesus Christ and the persecution they have suffered thru time is a result of Gods displeasure with them. It's that simple. daddisam, I hope you're reading. I think your question about why some people react negatively to Christians who wear their Christianity on their sleeve (or on the label of the baseball bat with which they're about to cave in your unbelieving skull) should be answered by now. But I must point out that, once again, you're crying persecution where no one, that I can see, has broadly objected to Christians. red terror alluded to a particular subset or mind-set of self-proclaimed Christians -- a mindset that, it should be noted, is not all that accepting of many other flavors of Christianity. My sister is a Roman Catholic nun, and I'm quite sure that Falwell and his ilk would label her as part of the problem, just to give one example. Me, I don't have any problem with Christians. I do have a very big problem with those who demonize and dehumanize others, and that seems all too central to the MO of the most prominent fundamentalist Christians. It isn't "Christian-bashing" to point out the evil that these people do.
posted by lil_brown_bat at 06:43 PM on May 17
Us newbes are stupid! Can we get that as a tagline?
posted by dusted at 06:44 PM on May 17
News alert: Jesus of Nazareth was BORN and DIED a JEW. John the Baptist was BORN and DIED a JEW. Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Moses, David, Samuel, Ezekiel, Isaiah, Daniel, the Apostles -- all of 'em -- BORN & BRED JEWS. Where in the Bible does it say Jews deserve persecution? Seriously, your beliefs are supposedly held in THE WORD, where in The Bible does it say that? Not looking for PC agenda here, just quote scripture, please. If Yahweh ain't happy with Jews, then pray tell true believer, how do you think he feels about an unrepentant America? How do you think he feels about Pat Roberston and Jerry Falwell blaspheming and abusing His name to justify the killing of innocent people?
posted by the red terror at 06:57 PM on May 17
bluekarma...so let me get this straight: God = good You believe in God so therefore... You = good Jew = bad Do I have that right?
posted by Texan_lost_in_NY at 07:04 PM on May 17
Texan> It's the old canard about the Jews using their trickery to get the Romans to fulfill Biblical prophecy and condemn God's Son onto a cross, and for that God will punish the sins of the fathers for the next, oooh, how many millenia ya got until Revelation is fulfilled and Pat Robertson disappears into the Rapture??
posted by the red terror at 07:13 PM on May 17
Don't go too crazy over bluekarma's words. Look through his comments - I don't think you'll find a single thing that isn't either negative or just plain incendiary. It's his MO. He does it on purpose. He's getting your goats. Don't give him your goats. Guard your goats, y'all!
posted by Samsonov14 at 07:19 PM on May 17
Yeah, you're both right...and I'm not in a change-the-world mood so it's better just to ignore the...hmmm...ignorant? Yep, that's the word. This drive-by style the blue one uses is very intriguing though, I have to say. Instant karma's gonna get you...
posted by Texan_lost_in_NY at 08:43 PM on May 17
Red terror, The bottom line is that I know what I believe. I know whats written in the bible. I am not going into how you have gotten many of your facts wrong. I was taught not to judge others. I would challenge you guys to actually read the bible rather that take what others say it said. The are a lot of false prophets in today's world. You'll find them everywhere in your common demominations, the catholic church, in fundementalists church-they can be found everywhere---Even with people who say that there is no God.. Blaming the jews for death of Jesus is one "story" that holds no water if you truely follow what the Bible says...I am not going to go into detail here because its a very complicated story. One thats worth listening too. What bothers me is how Christains get lumped into the same negative mold. I truely believe in "God's will" at work in our world. That said, some of the comments made by Falwell and Robinson made about 9/11 make me nervous. Just like bluekarma's words also make me nervous. I am not crying percecution--I am just pointing out that some of you are making too many assusmptions about the Christain faith. Lots of things are happening in our world and many people are looking for answers. Most of you have been really kind to me even though yo dont agree with most of the stuff I write. I am just ask that you dont judge Christains unless you know what is the truth and what isnt. Much of what has been said about the Jews here is not accurate. Jesus was a Jew and so was his a Apostles--everything else is a little fuzzy. Red Terror-Its my Crhistain faith based views that allows me to deal with the reality of this world. Without faith, your life becomes worthless.. That is my point of view.
posted by daddisamm at 10:34 PM on May 17
Daddisamm, how should we view your comments which come out of your religious beliefs other than by the company, so to spek, you keep? You suggest none of us have read the Bible but you have no way of knowing whether that's true or not. You claim my life is worthless because I don't share your faith, yet you've never met me nor do you know any meaningful details of my life. You make blanket statements, to my eyes pretty much the same as I see from other self-identifying Christians, and then claim to be victimized by being grouped with them. This thread is a good example. There aren't many Jews among the regulars here, as far as I know, but I'm one yet I've refrained from crying for any pity over this silly stadium business nor am I asking for it now. For me, not even worth a comment. But your assertions really do get my goat. I hope I haven't used any words that are too difficult for your newbie mind to grasp.
posted by billsaysthis at 11:51 PM on May 17
and who the hell are you people to say karma is going to get me? God? Awfully presumptous of you to think you can cause something bad to happen to someone who deosnt believe what you do? I know that Jesus was a Jew. How stupid to think I didn't know basic biblical knowledge. Only boring pompous asses would presume someone didn't know Jesus and all the other central characters in the bible weren't jewish??? Gimme a break. Maybe your the moron for thinking that. Jews are still reaping "karma" for their rejection of the Messiah. Fact.
posted by bluekarma at 02:18 AM on May 18
You might be mistaking Karma for Dharma.
posted by Samsonov14 at 03:04 AM on May 18
Mmmmm ... Dharma. Other than that, I'm not getting involved in another one of these arguments. They all end up sounding like the Inquisition.
posted by wfrazerjr at 07:44 AM on May 18
I think he meant schwarma.
posted by smithers at 08:06 AM on May 18
Other than that, I'm not getting involved in another one of these arguments. They all end up sounding like the Inquisition. I wasn't expecting that.
posted by Mr Bismarck at 08:19 AM on May 18
It is understandable that some here have religious beliefs. And frankly, so do I. Very deeply held beliefs as shared to me by the Arch-Angel Melchizadek. Alas, Melchizadek told me, "We are already in the Great Tribulation." But, but ... that can't be true, I sputtered. It's not possible -- no way it could have happened!! Like, like, like --Where-where-where's the Rapture? Well, Melchizadek told me, it didn't exactly work out as planned in either the Book of Revelation, nor that wicked kickass Indiana Jones-for pussies "Left Behind" series. (It's a best-seller, if you secular heathen didn't know). Melchizadek gave me a parachute and let me don't gently. He understood this came as a complete shock. Jesus of Nazareth came down, Melchizadek related, for a Second Coming -- took a look around, and did a little sputtering himself. Jesus Wept. "None of you dumb fuck shitheads are worthy to enter My Kingdom. You assholes -- yeah, ALL OF YA -- are a bunch of sicko hypocrite cum-swallowers who wouldn't know the first Goddamn thing what I preached, 'cuz you're too busy inventing bullshit to care. Back to pre-school, morons." As usual, Jesus was right on the money. Naturally, his loyal "servants" at the pulpit didn't notice the Miracle -- this Fulfillment of Biblical Prophecy -- right under their noses. Nope, Jerry Falwell, Pat Robertson, James Dobson and the rest of his Focus on the Family retards were too preoccupied gnashing their pearly whites, flogging homosexuals and the ACLU, and provoking wars to pay any attention to that bearded Jew hippie freak in a bloodied loin-cloth and crown of thorns. Richard Pearle went on Hannity & Colmes, insisting this was MORE PROOF of an Al Qaeda nexis in their midst. Jesus Wept Again. "I'm the fuck outta here losers. I've been crucified by the Romans once, I really don't need to go through this bullshit a Second time with you mob of smug shithead motherfuck New Romans." Ooooh, such filthy terrible language, Mr. Dobson recoiled. "What WILL we tell the little children?" Alas, Melchizadek said, the Son of God is an Angry Son of God, and it was only His Forgiveness that Saved YOU from a well-deserved Smiting From Above. "I'll let it pass -- this time," Jesus said. "May 9/11 serve as a tiny hors d'ouvre for the Eternal Damnation that's gonna come, 'cuz I ain't saving your pansy-asses any longer *snif-f-f-f-f-f-f-f* IF ya Suh-Mell ... what the ROCK ... is ... Cook-in." Melchizadek said that Jesus departed the abyss a.k.a Earthly Realm -- minutes before the Office of Homeland Security could whisk him off to Abu Ghraib and proclaim the mystery man on the ABC/CBS/NBC/FOX/CNN Nightly Brainwashing as Bin Laden's Brigadier General #3 and "Mastermind of the WTC attacks." This was extremely hurtful to me and my beliefs. "Some in the sicko pervert librul news media will deny this ever happened," said Melchizadek, "but then they're the same sort who'll sell their mothers for a piece of Key Lime Pie, and pay no attention to that cock crowing three times. Fact is, it not only happened, it's the Gospel Truth. Do yourself a favor and give up on Repentance -- He's already come and gone. Let's party like it's 1999 again and Onward Christian Soldiers into Iran, like it's 2003 again." This Truth ripped my guts out. Don't hate me because I am Melchizadek's True Messenger. I am only reporting the FACTS as offered to me in the form of a Burnt Offering (a piece of toast) -- and Melchizadek would never, ever lie. Don't shoot the messenger. After I spread a little marmalade BUT BEFORE I could wash it down with my morning coffee (one cream, two sugars), Melchizadek got very, very stern and serious, swearing to me in no uncertain terms that should anyone doubt his message, that they reject the True Messiah. Amen Brothers, he closed. Hallellujah l'il sisters. And Maranatha to all the Mommies and Daddies and especially Santa Claus.
posted by the red terror at 09:01 AM on May 18
I wasn't expecting that. nooobody expects...
posted by goddam at 09:33 AM on May 18
I never suggested that none of your ead the Bible. Blanket Statements? If I offended yo I am sorry. My point is that people should be sure of their facts before they make a statement. In this case, they need to read that part of the bible to get the story straight. I often re-read parts of the Bible to better understand. Billy-if you and I sat down face to face and talked about this., you'd find that we are closer than you think. I am not one to put myself above others.. Its my Crhistain faith based views that allows me to deal with the reality of this world. Without faith, your life becomes worthless.. That is my point of view. Billy-this is a general statement. when I used the word "your" I wasnt talking about anybody specific. You could have put a variety or words in there. Bottom line, Without faith my life would be worthless. I am sorry if you took this as a blanket statement it wasnt meant to be.
posted by daddisamm at 09:42 AM on May 18
The problem seems to be that religion is being politicized to justify acts that have no legitimate basis in religion. Those currently in power in our country are invoking religion to do political acts. It is just a shroud that they are using to cover their actions. Then those who oppose such actions are attacking the shroud and justification that is being used (i.e. Christianity). I am sure most of us can agree that while some Christians support these political efforts, others are more skeptical. In fact, lots of Christians are against abortion, the death penalty and war. I think it important to recognize that Robertson, Falwell & Bush do not represent Christianity anymore than terrorists represent Islam.
posted by bperk at 09:43 AM on May 18
It is just a shroud that they are using to cover their actions. Yeah, it's the Shroud of Turin that Lord Bush uses for a cape when he fearlessly leads his Crusade: "Onward Christian Soldiers!!" What would Jesus Do Georgey-boy? "Same thing Grampy Prescott did for Auschwitz...We kick ass for the Lord!!"
posted by the red terror at 10:07 AM on May 18
They all end up sounding like the Inquisition. The Inquisition? (its about a 13 mb file so keep that in mind if you click...)
posted by chris2sy at 10:32 AM on May 18
Found it! daddisam, you asked :"What is so scary about Christians?" Try this. Take particular care to scroll down and check out the photos of two good Christian soldiers protesting in Washington. Job 34:30: "That the hypocrite reign not, lest the people be ensnared."
posted by the red terror at 10:33 AM on May 18
Let's turn the volume down a bit, folks. Anything non-sports related after this comment will be deleted.
posted by rcade at 11:21 AM on May 18
Ahhhhhh, religon. You bridge-builder, you.
posted by WeedyMcSmokey at 12:20 PM on May 18
My cat's name is Mittens.
posted by wfrazerjr at 01:11 PM on May 18
so was mine!
posted by garfield at 01:16 PM on May 18
Mittens was a Nazi, and you both know it.
posted by Samsonov14 at 02:49 PM on May 18
href="http://www.startribune.com/stories/509/5411182.html">Appears that this has been known for a while. ie about the swastika... I am comfortable with the explanation given.
posted by daddisamm at 01:31 PM on May 19
I attemtped to do a link and I thnk I screwed up! I am not really smart when it comes to computers.
posted by daddisamm at 01:33 PM on May 19
Here you go: Twin Cities man sees swastika in Metrodome roof
posted by dusted at 01:34 PM on May 19
Thanks--Now I wish I could figure out how you did that! Thanks, dusted I owe you one! Anyway this story says about all that needs to be said about the subject, in my book.
posted by daddisamm at 01:47 PM on May 19
Y'know, I'm embarassed for even putting this much thought into it, but, if you follow this guy's logic, wouldn't all NBA courts that have alternating-grain parquet (the Celtics' home court comes to mind right away) just be awash in swastikas? Just did some checking... Target Center has alternating-grain parquet. Uh-oh
posted by cobra! at 01:49 PM on May 19
:-) yup and here come the black helecopters
posted by daddisamm at 02:36 PM on May 19
Now I wish I could figure out how you did that! Here is exactly what I typed:
posted by dusted at 03:37 PM on May 19
thanks dusted--I am well over do for my first link!
posted by daddisamm at 04:54 PM on May 19
This thread has been nothing but swastikaos!
posted by wfrazerjr at 07:59 PM on May 19
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