04/18/24
June 22, 2002
Spain robbed by linesman: All reports seem to be delighted for Korea but I'm absolutely fuming after seeing a perfectly legal goal disallowed. The decision was so bizarre I was thinking corruption must have something to do with it. Plus Spain were the better team. There should be an investigation.
That should read "if there wasn't any controversy, it wouldn't be the World Cup."
posted by 007 at 04:49 AM on June 22, 2002
I had little sympathy for Italy, even though there were some very dodgy decisions made against them in the group stages. But this error was so blatantly wrong as to bring the whole match into question. And I wasn't even really supporting Spain.
posted by Summer at 04:53 AM on June 22, 2002
I don't remember which particular off-sides call that was, but weren't they all--the 3 or so--whistled & flagged well before the (attempted) goal? But yeah, gotta hand it to Spain for their energetic hustling and attacking. Tough break with the penalty shot.
posted by ShinyKnows at 05:25 AM on June 22, 2002
Absolutely 100% no mistake about it, that ball was in. The two bodies competing for it in between the linesman and the ball were, in my opinion, the cause of the foul up, but the whistle blew just as the cross was taken. By the time the ball was flying from the header toward the goal everyone had stopped playing. Probably would've been a goal anyway, but the fact that the whistle (albeit to a mistaken call) came way before the actual shot was made means that it was bad luck, not robbery. For me, the questionable thing was Spain's blocked penalty kick. Looked like the guy purposefully stumbled before making a very weak shot. Let he with a perfect officiating record sling the first mud.
posted by Bixby23 at 05:30 AM on June 22, 2002
Looked like the guy purposefully stumbled before making a very weak shot. Heh, the thought crossed my mind too, but the logistics of buying the guy off would seem to entail all sorts of contingency planning and secrecy... nah. I've seen players try that stutter-step fakeout before.
posted by ShinyKnows at 05:39 AM on June 22, 2002
Well... as with the Italian goal we'll never know because the Korean team simply stopped playing. Before the cross was sent in. But that penalty was dodgy in a lot of ways. The keeper advanced a little bit off his line (but not really enough to warrant a retake), but the real dodgy part was having Joaquin take the penalty at all. He was limping the last few minutes of the game and you could see it in his face that he wasn't ready to take the penalty. According to the BBC he suffered a groin injury to his right foot. You just shouldn't send a player in that state to take the penalty. And I disagree that Spain were the better team. They only managed to dominate for a part of the first half and even then they seemed reluctant to push their advantage. You can't really expect to win if you don't do that.
posted by Kattullus at 06:12 AM on June 22, 2002
Kattullus: According to the BBC he suffered a groin injury to his right foot. I didn't know your right food had a groin :)
posted by 007 at 06:16 AM on June 22, 2002
I'm sorry Katullus, I seem to have seen a different match to you. But as it's a matter of opinion there's no point arguing.
posted by Summer at 06:29 AM on June 22, 2002
I am getting increasingly worried that there is a FIFA plot to let The Germans win the World Cup :)
posted by Ben at 06:51 AM on June 22, 2002
I've seen players try that stutter-step fakeout before. And at least two of the Spainards did just that in the Shoot-out against Ireland. But they scored. I found it cheap, but it worked then. Maybe it's just Karma b/c Spain knew that Ireland should've been there instead.
posted by Ufez Jones at 09:24 AM on June 22, 2002
< .02 euros from an american girl living in italy for 4 years> Most of the referees in this World Cup have been horrendous. And not just the matches where my beloved Azzurri played. Brazil-Turkey, Portugal-Korea, Belgium-Brazil spring to mind. Now Spain-Korea. Plot, schmot. I know the general accepted wisdom is that sometimes you profit from dodgy calls and other times you don't, but I would expect a higher quality of officiating for the World Cup. Then again, maybe I'm spoiled; Pierluigi Collina remains (for me) the standard to which the bar needs to be raised. (not to mention his facial expressions provide a fantastic secondary source of entertainment.) I don't remember as much hue and outcry against the refs for WC '98, nor Euro 2000. Then again, could be my admittedly faulty memory. However, one would hope that requirements for FIFA refs will undergo a change in the future. Maybe they can all take classes from Collina ;-)
posted by romakimmy at 09:27 AM on June 22, 2002
Is it me or is the person most surprised in the whole world at the Korean success Guss Hiddink? In the post-match interview he looked someone expecting to wake up any moment now.
posted by Kattullus at 12:00 PM on June 22, 2002
I meant Guus, of course. Oh, and I read that the Korean goalkeeper (who's been excellent by the way) had to battle hepatitis before winning a spot for himself in the team. That's spirit.
posted by Kattullus at 12:11 PM on June 22, 2002
All I'm saying is that it's beginning to become difficult, as in the famous Fawlty Towers episode, not to mention the war.;)
posted by Miguel Cardoso at 02:53 PM on June 22, 2002
Guus--heh, that does feel awkward to type--Hiddink.. looks like a class act. I heard him speaking fluent Spanish to a Univision reporter, so that makes him, far as I know, trilingual (on top of Dutch & English), and is most certainly boning up on some passable Korean while on the current job. Now he's the first coach to take two different national teams to the semis.
posted by ShinyKnows at 05:10 PM on June 22, 2002
And yeah, (referring back a few posts) ..Collina.. that ref is cool to watch. In a flattering way, he would translate well into a videogame or movie character. He's just so lovably expressive. Back to Hiddink.. I think his cautious-expectations approach has been right on.
posted by ShinyKnows at 05:23 PM on June 22, 2002
Hey, ShinyKnows, which passable Korean is Hiddink boning? hahahahaha. Couldn't resist. Anyway, on the multilingual tip, I was impressed to see (also on Univision) Reyna, Donovan and (I think) Agoos speaking fluent Spanish during interviews. Didn't realize Donovan had any of them had any Spanish-speaking background (it didn't look like they just picked it up from high school). Really a good reflection on the US team, I think. ct
posted by worldcup2002 at 05:26 PM on June 22, 2002
Speaking of that kind of boning, what about the Univision Lara Croft-ish-slash-techno babe who introduces the games? Hummana hummana. Univision's presentacion rocks.
posted by ShinyKnows at 05:51 PM on June 22, 2002
The ball was clearly in and no sane person could have thought otherwise. No T.V replays were needed, the linesman bottled it, pure and simple. I have seen at least a dozen replays now and in my hapless opinion the Koreans kept playing. Definite goal. I have said all over the place that that we need decent refs, the guy yesterday was from Egypt. What the hell would he know about it , really? When would he ever have faced pressure like that. The best officials should be appointed, regardless of whether some worthy but useless bank clerk from Malawi finds himself disappointed.
posted by Fat Buddha at 07:51 PM on June 22, 2002
At least there's now no reason why Collina won't get the final. (As he said in an interview before the finals, the best teams usually make it to the final, but the best referee might not. No problem now.) All he needs is a pair of linesmen with a pair of eyes each.
posted by etagloh at 08:25 PM on June 22, 2002
Collina rocks. I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Whatever we may think of the Italian soccer team, this guy is a credit to his country and his profession. Collina! Collina! Collina! Molto bene!
posted by worldcup2002 at 10:27 AM on June 24, 2002
worldcup2002, Collina is 'bravissimo', not merely 'molto bene' ;-) Breaking news: Collina to replace Berlusconi in Italian Government. Heh. Don't I bloody wish.
posted by romakimmy at 01:53 PM on June 24, 2002
Oh man, not a controversial game in the World Cup; that never happens :) I didn't get to see the game - I'll have to wait for the replay tonight - but from reading various reports it seems that Spain's goal in overtime was definitely good and the linesman made a mistake. With all the controversy in this World Cup, can a case be made for using some sort of video replay on the field? As a compromise with the purists, maybe it could be used only when a goal is going to be disallowed or allowed or when a penalty kick is to be given? As much as I want Korea to go through, a lot of the fun is really taken out when there's controversy afterwards whether a team should really have won or not. But, I guess if there wasn't any controversy, it would be the World Cup. Sigh.