Also, and I'm talking to myself here, but the assumption that only newly registered members troll is false. And the link in the thread given as an example is trollish itself, so stupid responses were to be expected. I dig. I know exactly what you mean. Every so often, a low numbered troll pops up. The thing is, we're being flooded. We know the source of the flood, so plug it up for a bit, deal with the mess at hand and clean up the active and dormant (low number random) trolls and when things have calmed down, maybe we consider opening membership back up again. There's never really going to be a "slow time" to deal with it, so it might be up to us to just curb the flow of membership and create a slow(er) time to clean up Aisle SpoFi. If it's not World Cup action, it's hockey or basketball finales, and then baseball playoffs, NFL kickoff, drafts, blah blah blah. Lather, rinse, repeat.
I really can't tell which is worse the trolls or the elitist mentallity. Ignore these fucks or throw a couple of insults there way and move on.
Its not elitist to want to clean up the board for the sake of preservation, Hater. I presume you wouldn't let people just throw shit in your yard or come by to piss on your azaleas and battle it with a "I don't see you!" or "Hey, small pecker pal!" and go back in the house. That solves nothing. You put a stop to it. You work on preventing it. Otherwise, we have an ESPN board with a beautiful randomized header graphic.
Oh, and giving the banhammer to more people has been discussed and refused dozens of times already. Not gonna happen. posted by qbert72 That's not the problem qbert, and it never has been. Read this thread. When that's complete, we're going to add better administrative tools to deal with abusive users and flamewars and implement some long-requested features that have been waiting on a server move. -rcade It has never been about more people. The admin tools as of now are simply not up to the task. You could give the admin rights to 10 more people and it would accomplish nothing. There's no 'ban' button. It takes 24 to 48 hours to get someone banned. This thread is begging for trolls. But for the most part, I'm pretty sure the extent of trolling in soccer threads will be the occasional 'soccer sucks' line. We have decided to go with a quick ban for 'your sport sucks' post. But again, when it takes a day or two to ban that person, they can cause a lot of noise in the mean time. I'd hate to see signups closed, simply because the world cup could attract good members, and as already pointed out, trolling comments will also come from long time members.
JG, Hater may be referring to me throwing out the I-word in response to the trolls, and I actually see where he's coming from. In defense, my personal experience has been those who don't like the sport wear blinders and have no interest in supporting anything not "Made In America." And, in general, their life philosophy is equally limited. I don't personally feel that loving soccer makes me "elite" (if you only knew...), but I do take pride in the ability to view the world as an open book and not follow the herd. Anyway, without actually knowing the person making the comment, I see HATER's point. And of course I go way overboard (intentionally) with the political references in response...
In order to clean up Gary, Kirk and Rogers would need to start banning and ban hardcore, which is something they are not willing to do. It's their site and they can run it however they want. I think a the 5 bucks is a great idea but again it really doesn't matter what I think. I personally think the best approach is to point out when someone is being a douche and just move it right along. In regards to prevention, just lock the door and shut the lights. Freeze new memberships and weed out the shitheads. I really didn't mean to single anyone with the elitist remark I was just kind of shooting from the hip.
Thanks for the clarification, Tex and Hater.
That's not the problem qbert, and it never has been. I know, that's what I meant. You've always been very clear that there is no admin manpower issue, and that you don't want or need anybody else on board, which is fine by me.
I know, that's what I meant. You've always been very clear that there is no admin manpower issue, and that you don't want or need anybody else on board, which is fine by me. Well, that sounds harsh, which is not what I meant. I'm just pointing out what the problem is. I can't give out the banhammer when I don't have one myself. If more people was the problem I'd be the first to request it. Metafilter is run by two people, and it's much bigger than sportsfilter. But they have a flagging system, and a giant ban button by each members name (or something similar). In order to clean up Gary, Kirk and Rogers would need to start banning and ban hardcore, which is something they are not willing to do. But we are. If you come into a thread to yell 'your sport sucks', you're going to be banned. It's the actual banning that has to be improved.
I personally think the best approach is to point out when someone is being a douche and just move it right along. But we've been having this conversation for a couple of years. I'm honestly the last person I would ever imagine asking for a temporary close, but when I checked the site on Sunday I didn't really want to come back*. It looked like any other shitty Yahoo board with a bunch of people who don't know each other and don't care about the place and don't see that an online community is a community. I can get that shit on the streets. While I am all for anarchic free-for-alls, I've never claimed to be anything but an elitist. Save me from the ESPN/Yahoo knuckle-dragging reprobrates. Closing the doors for a bit did nothing but improve Mefi's status, as mentioned above. * This shouldn't been seen as me saying anything more than I felt that way at the time. No dramatic exits for me. Always with a whimper, never a bang, much to my wife's consternation.
Sorry Gary, didn't mean to put words in your mouth. I thinks it's a pretty good policy you guys are instituting.
I'm just going to give a hearty "Hear, hear" to that, fatty. I wouldn't mind shutting it down. But, honestly, even after 2600-odd comments, the trolls don't get me down. Or shut me up. Sometimes, when my computer isn't working, I argue about Barry Bonds to my goldfish. I usually cite grum. The goldfish ain't buying it though, grum. He's all "Cheating is cheating! Ban him! Kill the Pope!" and whatnot. I guess my point is that decaf really is as tasty as the caffinated, and can be a suitable alternative.
Sorry Gary, didn't mean to put words in your mouth. Well, I understand. Because our banning procedure is so flawed it definitely appears we're lazy on the banning.
In order to clean up Gary, Kirk and Rogers would need to start banning and ban hardcore, which is something they are not willing to do. Thank God for that. Without hardcore, what is life?
How about closing the site down completely for a couple of months? Benefits would be numerous: * Time to build/test/deploy a capable SpoFi 2.0 * SpoFi would lose its place on My Yahoo! * No more trolls! * We would be reminded how much we love this place * I could get some more work done! Think about it.
I've bitched quite a bit on this particular subject, and come to the conclusion that we must drown the trolls in our SHEER AWESOMENESS. For all the trolls, has anyone noticed that the quality of FPPs have incrementally gotten better over time? That fewer links are leading to boxscores, recaps, or, dare I say it, ESPN or Yahoo? I think we need to take the same grassroots approach to commenting. Zingers, wedgies, wet-willies, and out and out caning other members will always be acceptable but maybe if we continue to talk like grown-ups all the trolls will go back to sitting at the kiddie table.
Without hardcore, what is life? All Cinemax, all the time. we must drown the trolls in our SHEER AWESOMENESS It never works, because you have to explain all the references and that ruins the joke.
It never works, because you have to explain all the references and that ruins the joke. Fuck'em, let them use "search".
Closing the doors for a bit did nothing but improve Mefi's status, as mentioned above. Sorta. It did make MeFi seem like quite the cool place to be, but then the doors opened again. :| we must drown the trolls in our SHEER AWESOMENESS Dude, we're totally outnumbered on this one. And my guess is that a lot of the trolls have just as much time to read/post to SpoFi as I do, which is every second of the 40 hours I am required to sit at this desk. There are millions of us, doing nothing but sitting before a computer connected to the internet for 1/4 of a week, and a huge portion of us are sports fans. The majority of those desk-sitting sports fans are inevitably morons. I will grant that we occasionally find a diamond in the rough (speaking of which: whatever happened to daddisamm? I miss him). But still, it comes down to math and demographics: too many idiots. Honestly, we've had quality posts about PEDs, and what do they turn into? A really long thread about "Bondz sux!!!1! cuz he CHEETD! l0l" with grum sometimes popping in to offer some mostly-unappreciated enlightenment. Or how about the quality football posts that inevitably get turned into a discussion of T.O.? Maybe the answer is two threads, always at the top of the page: one on Bonds, and one on T.O. And one on how Soccer sucks and racing is not a sport, so make it three, really. Also, what yerfatma said
Always with a whimper, never a bang, much to my wife's consternation. I've been saying that about you for years.
In my pre-Spofi days I could see myself making a, "soccer blows" crack just for fun, after I was here for a couple months I realized that sort of sport bashing wasn't welcome around here anyway. Then I started reading alot of the soccer threads and my interest has skyrocketed in soccer, now I'm pretty pumped about world cup. My high school didn't even have soccer and when I got to college I largely ignored it, now that I'm getting more exposure to it I'm intrigued. So, what I'm trying to say is have some patience with the soccer trolls. If my first soccer thread I ever read would have devolved into a, "our futbol is better than your football" shitfest, I probably would developed a soccer grudge.
whatever happened to daddisamm? I miss him He didn't enjoy that we didn't enjoy him proselytizing.
But still, it comes down to math As such, I feel obligated to point out 40 hours is not quite a quarter of my week (not even 24%). You folks on the metric system in Wisconsin?
He also might have died. He was a pretty sick fellow.
Doubtful... his most recent comment was only a couple weeks ago. But that was my first thought, too.
You folks on the metric system in Wisconsin? I work for a science company, so yeah, sorta. Besides, I'm guessing you still sit at a computer connected to the internet for at least 42 hours a week, whether it's at work or elsewhere. I'd guess the same is true for others.
You folks on the metric system in Wisconsin? Litera Cola, do we have Litera Cola?
whatever happened to daddisamm? I miss him jerseygirl kept pickin' on him.
I guess I could just stop posting Steven Wells links. That would probably help, as they are pure troll feed. Somewhat ironic maybe was that the gist of Swell's piece was that the US will soon be a soccer superpower. I wondered if that would pass people by amidst the inflammatory rhetoric. And it often did. Zoom! People will doubtless still be posting about the World Cup regularly though. And you can bet even the uncontentious threads will draw their fair share of flak. Doesn't bother me. I quite enjoy gingerly poking trolls with a stick. Though I do realise I should rise above it for the common good. Oh, Djibril Cisse has broken his leg in a friendly against China. I'm sure that'll cheer up the scouse wannabees amongst us.
I've bitched quite a bit on this particular subject, and come to the conclusion that we must drown the trolls in our SHEER AWESOMENESS. I'm with lilnemo, and I believe. Let us unleash a veritable FLOOD of awesomeness, smiting our enemies (and their firstborn). Dude, we're totally outnumbered on this one. That's defeatist! Awesomeness begets more awesomeness. Let the awesome "we" of SportFilter inspire the dormant awesomeness in others!
...I'm sure that'll cheer up the scouse wannabees amongst us. And God knows there aren't enough of them.
jerseygirl kept pickin' on him. Son of a bee sting! I did not, Mr Hand, sir!
He also might have died. He was a pretty sick fellow. Dude. I mean.... d00d...I hate that I'm even chuckling at that one. On topic: There are trolls for every major sporting event that chime in with their self-important "[Your Favorite Sport] Sucks" and this has been the case since the beginning of SpoFi. Hell, I even remember when a certain soccer-loving SpoFite with a three-digit user number that is now regarded as a stable, useful member got smacked down for constantly posting "Baseball sucks and it is boring, blah blah blah" after he first joined. You kind of have to gently guide and occasionally nip at the heels, like a herding dog. And ignore the asshats. Always ignore the asshats.
I know I'm a bit of a newbie, and that I get pretty lippy in my posts sometimes, but none-the-less I really appreciate SpoFi, and I'd be all for anything that might make the community more of a community. If it means that I need to ignore the trolls, or whatever, I'll do it, but I really think at some point we are going to need some more tangibly defined rules, so when someone breaks the rules its a black and white violation, and it can be pointed out as such. Just my two Lincolns.
everett, what is the deal with that halo guy that seems to be your golf friend?
squealy: please don't stop posting the s. wells links- they are great.
I personally think the best approach is to point out when someone is being a douche and just move it right along. Uhoh.
The only problem with drowning trolls in awesomeness is this exchange between Amateur and tommytrump. The ratio of quality comments to crap comments is so skewed that people don't even realize that they should raise their game. When I discovered SpoFi the vast majority of posts were great, so it took about 5 seconds to realize what this site was about.
Being one of the noobeeist of noobs (if that makes sence) that ventures into the locker room to keep up with whats going on behind the scenes, I think drowning the trolls in our SHEER AWESOMENESS works at times. I don't post all that often but I visit SpoFi a few times a day and have noticed a few members that started out as trolls but after a good "talking too" by other Spofites become productive members. I enjoy the edgeumacation I get reading about sports I know nothing about as well as learning more about the sports I love. Im looking forward to the World Cup (started playing soccer in the early 70's) and all the posts that will come with it. Trolls or not, this is going to be fun.
jerseygirl, he was not my friend at all, not even in the least. I was making fun of him, and he thought it was funny. I could tell he thought it was funny, because he ended his meassage with "lol"... You know, the inernational sign for haha, thats funny, and i'm a douche.
oh. Good. Phew. Yeah, that was an odd exchange between you guys. I couldn't tell if he was really your pal or he was a just simply a db.
Ufez, I believe I resemble that remark! But you're right and I'm very happy the rest of you helped me learn this lesson. Though I still think baseball is the sux0r of course.
Hey, our awesomeness prevailed, I think.
BOO-YAH! -signed the boo-yah guy
I don't think I've ever seen a troll reform and concede. This is odd.
It's happened. I wish it happened a lot more often, but if you believe in life after love, I can feel something inside me say I really don't think we're strong enough... ...sorry, what was I saying? Right. Knucklehead reformations are unfortunately still the very rare exception, and not the rule.
...sorry, what was I saying? You were outing yourself as a Cher superfan, Suzy.
That's Mister Suzy to you, cupcake.
Sorry, Mr. Suzy!
/shuts off vocoder Much better
Thanks for that, you unconscionable arseholes - now I'm going to be singing Cher all day. Or at least until the opening ceremony of the World Cup later, when I assume Cher will be bunted aside as the day's earworm, only to be replaced by the Hoff. (I assume they got him?) As regards the topic - shutting the place down completely, or shutting it down to new members, for a while would be a really backward step I think. It would only work if it was the same people trolling day in, day out, but it isn't. I think we just have to be resigned to the fact that a certain (usually large) percentage of new members will be trolls who will shoot their mouths off for a few days, get bored, and then leave. I like the shock and awesomeness tactic, and I agree with whoever mentioned the fact that the posts have improved since the rallying cry last went out. If we keep posting high standard FPP's, the wheat will stay and the chaff will blow away. And I'm still singing Cher, you wankers.
Der Hoff would be conspicuous by his absence from the WC, and if he does show and Germany wins big, you know they won't let him leave. I was a believer in closing membership for a while, but I'd be willing to give the new flagging-and-better-banning thing a go before that gets tried.
if he does show and Germany wins big, you know they won't let him leave /dons Germany gear, begins rooting
Something else, which just occurred to me this minute (and may have been mentioned before - if so, sorry), might be to charge a one-time $5 membership fee that entitles you to post FPPs. Without that grade of membership, you can still read and post comments, but you can't (for example) hijack the front page. I'm not sure it would work, and I'm not a big fan of a two tier system that could lead to all sorts of "them and us" issues, but I thought I'd throw it out there anyway. For me, this place is more about the cool links to great writing or interesting takes on things than it is about providing a forum to discuss whether or not Wayne Rooney is going to be fit for the opening game. Having said that, I've just been suckered into helping turn the interesting post about the US team's security arrangements into yet another "They won't get out of the group"... "Oh yes they will" discussion.
Threads like this one drive me funking bonkers. There is no room for a rational discussion in a he said/she said on going rape investigation with racial undertones. Its just begging for assholery.
only to be replaced by the Hoff. (I assume they got him?) i heard he had a scheduling conflict. Right Said Fred will be performing, though.
Well, that got rid of Cher for me. Now I'm too sexy for my shirt. It would seem we've found an anti-troll weapon; for the next month, every trolling thread shall be turned into a World Cup nonsense fest.
What we need to do, as seasoned and knowledgeable members of SpoFi, is get in there early, call the thread out (nicely) as potential trouble (especially if it's a repeat of a previous tractor trailer rollover topic we've had, as in this case) and neutralize the fucking thing. Maybe if we put a call towards civil behavior, recognize that this topic will again cause us issues, we can band together to stop the juggernaut before it starts a pissing match. At that point we steer the thread in either a silly direction (Anchorman/Simpsons quotes, etc) or a completely different topic until Gary or rcade can delete it.
The duke story was a no brainer, for many reasons (as it looks like everyone knew). The wiretap story should have been added on to the story from the day before (as some in thread said). A good clue would be that there's no discussion of the actual link, just continued discussion of the story. But there was already quite a few rational comments in it, so I hated to just delete it. With better admin tool we could just move the link with comments into the previous thread. I'm working on some new guidelines, hopefully out this week, that will help with these type situations. The guidelines as is don't really tell members these things. They just have to "know".
Can one of those new guidelines be, "If you're new and you post 4000 lame wire stories a week, fuck you." I realize it lacks a certain imperative that good instructions have, but it would give me some satisfaction.
"If you're new and you post 4000 lame wire stories a week, fuck you." Well, give or take a few words.
Ditto. For some reason, that guy really, really irks me. Although there's a sort of silver lining: he's posting crap links that attract all the trolls. A well-written post with a quality link will go a long way to keeping out trolls. If we keep the discussion above their heads, maybe we'll have to deal with them less?
We ban more no-hope newbies than people might think. One of the best ways to get waived is to drop a bunch of your-sport-sucks on a discussion. Trolls who hate the World Cup are in for a long month here on SportsFilter.
There's a new idea for trolling: create a Forlorn Hope of trolls and throw yourself on the breastworks of a forum until an opening appears. "Once more unto the breach, dear fucksticks!" Also: your favorite sport really does suck.
Also: your favorite sport really does suck. Ha, so you do admit it IS a sport!
Trolls who hate the World Cup are in for a long month here on SportsFilter. Or a really short one.
The only problem with drowning trolls in awesomeness is this exchange between Amateur and tommytrump. bperk, are you saying that sometimes I write things that are not awesome? Fair enough, I do. In light of lilnemo's call to action, I probably should resist that kind of snark in the future. In this case, though, I think calling out tommytrump was a calculated risk. That thread was not yet overrun, and my assessment of tommytrump is that he actually might care enough to change. I wouldn't have said those things to just anybody. Tommytrump, although he says lots of things I disagree with, is not a troll (IMO). And I would point out that my barb did have an effect. For the rest of the thread, at least, he did locate the 'shift' key.
No, Amatuer, your post was awesome. Tommytrump's response was that 90% of posts on spofi are not awesome. Folks like tommytrump that are not trolling don't even realize that they should be doing better until someone (like you) tells them so.
May I just say what an excellent job the Pantheon have done in keeping Aisle: Soccer dirt and slip free. Of course, being Sunday evening the response may understandably be not as speedy as usual, you guys have certainly outdone yourselves. In fact, it is so appreciated I vow not to respond to the numbnuts until late July. Cheers.
This guy should just go. He spent the day attacking Grum, and a couple other people. He's never going to turn into a swan.
