Holden- I agree somewhat- I would rather see our players go overseas as well. It is the only way to raise their game. However, to build the league, MLS needs to keep homegrown talent. Otherwise the league suffers and there is no pro league to play in for prospective players. Then as a result NO decent national team. I and many other good players were victim of that scenario in the mid 80's. No league, no incentive to try to play professionally for less than 20k a year. If the league builds properly and makes itself a top notch league we do that by keeping talent, not letting it go and get lesser players to build it up. Without a strong US league, the foundation is not here, but overseas. That doesnt work at an international level, due to travel and release strains. The strong international competitors do so by keeping their best players. Example- Owen Hargreaves is the only national player from England not in the EPL. And they are trying very hard to get him back there. On how to build a strong national side, I guess it's really a question of cause and effect that has no easily discernible answer -- that is, whether strengthening national team players in foreign leagues will lead to a better MNT will lead to a better domestic league or if a better domestic league is more of a prerequisite to getting to a better MNT. Unless there are studies out there that show empirically that one approach is better than another, then I guess we will just have to agree to disagree. I personally would prefer to see a stronger MNT than a stronger domestic league at this point, but maybe my views would change if MLS could really put out a consistently good product. As to your England example, I personally think that England would be better off for international play if more of its players played in the Liga and Serie A. England needs more creativity and the ability to create goals, something that is somewhat lacking in EPL (certainly this year). I can recall only a handful of English players playing elsewhere in Europe in the last several years (Hargreaves, McManaman, Owen, Beckham?). The exposure to different styles of football certainly couldn't hurt. Also, France and Holland have inferior domestic leagues and I would say over half of their players play elsewhere (probably more like 3/4 for Holland), yet they are in the upper echelon of international sides. The difference between those countries and the U.S. with respect to domestic leagues, however, is that the youth programs at places like Ajax, PSV Eindhoven, Lyon and Marseilles do a great job of developing local talent. The U.S. is sorely lacking in development programs associated with clubs.
Soccer will NEVER be as poplar as the established sports here in the states, I don't care who they bring over to play. It will never work well enough to get me to watch a game. I would rather do yard work than watch a horrible soccer match, much to boring for me. I'll watch Canada's version of it..hockey..LOL
KTHXBYE!
Soccer will NEVER be as poplar as the established sports here in the states Maybe not, but I could definitely see it being as birch or maple as the established sports and possibly more hickory than the established sports.
Do you think we can sell tickets for people who want to go see Oasis do yardwork? I'll go set up an ebay store now.
Do you think we can sell tickets for people who want to go see Oasis do yardwork? Only if the brothers Gallagher go at each other with a rake and a hoe.
Thank you, Texan. The thing is, you know they have.
Do you think we can sell tickets for people who want to go see Oasis do yardwork? heh
Here we go again. I'm not even going to diss soccer, its a very difficult sport to play. However I must say that I dont think Beckham can inspire kids like you guys think he can. I think most of America wont even look at him as one of their own. He doesnt even sound like an American anymore with that prissy accent and that isnt going to sit well in the south to say the least. I wish him luck as he isnt taking any food out of my mouth. And if I were a defender I would break him the first chance I got just for being so crazy paid. Anyway I think an atmosphere of excitement starts from the lower levels and works its way up. If you cant get people to watch highschool soccer or college soccer then it has no future. Needless to say the big 3 dont have that problem.
The worst case scenario? David Beckham becomes the Mario Lemieux of soccer. chico -- can you elaborate on what you mean by this? Sorry about that, holden. I wandered away from the thread prematurely. What I meant by that was, the worst case scenario for Becks would be that the franchise and the league go so far south despite his efforts that the league declares some form of bankruptcy, and as their largest creditor, he winds up as the owner of the Galaxy, or of the league as a whole. Like what happened to Mario in Pittsburgh.
I agree that soccer is a hard game to play, I'm not sure how it is in the rest of the country but where I live at soccer does not get much funding and even less news paper time, as a few guys have stated it has to start in the Youth leagues and it's popularity has to grow from their. It needs more scoring to keep fan interest..and watching me do yard work would not only be boring but painful..LOL
Has anybody taken the time to research who is behind this deal? None other than American Idol bad boy & agent, Simon Cowell.
Oasis, not sure where you live but out here in the Bay Area there are not enough fields for all the teams--kids and adults--who want to play and there is plenty of funding. Stanford, one town over from me, is building (or just built) a new multi-field complex as part of a deal with the city of Palo Alto to allow expansion of their shopping mall. Urall: Fulham paid $4 million, not three, and I doubt it was a question of letting him go but rather getting a nice price rather than nothing when his contract expired and he went anyway. Personally I think these deals are positive for MLS and hope more are made for three reasons: - MLS developing a reputation for grooming quality players a la Netherlands, French, Portugese clubs is a big boost in stature, tying the league more tightly into the international football infrastructure - Players face top quality opponents every week and make the MNT stronger, leading to consistently better tournament results - Raises the profile of American football among global soccer fans All three factors offer a positive feedback loop that can help MLS and the MNT reach the top tier over time (and I mean years, not the short term), and the size of our market means that when that happens players will be clamoring to join MLS clubs rather than the other direction and Beckham/Davids-style deals. Psycho: American Soccer Idol, coming to Fox in Fall 2007!
We have more soccer fields than kids to play on them. The funding for the High School level teams has been one of the first budget cuts they made, hard to get the best athletes to commit to such a tough game when they can make more money playing an easier game, Maybe by having the Europeans come over and give the sport a boost might work. It's hard to get TV to commit 90 minutes to games though.
We have more soccer fields than kids to play on them. Really? You think you have more fields than necessary to handle more than 3,000,000 kids who play soccer in the USA each year? It's hard to get TV to commit 90 minutes to games though. ...as opposed to the 4+ hours they need for American football.
grum, sorry, I meant to say that we (here in the Bay Area, not all of the US) do NOT have enough enough fields for all the teams. I was typing in anger, forgive me.
billsaysthis: I think we were saying the same thing. I was responding to the original post (about more fields than kids), just like you were.
grum: the big difference there is that American football also offers a commercials galore. There is plenty of time between possession changes, end of quarters, timeouts, etc. for sponsors to get their messages across. Hockey, for instance, has TV timeouts to increase breaks since normal stoppage of play does not always allow enough time for a round of commercials to play. Baseball has no shortage of breaks. Basketball, plenty of timeouts and breaks as well. Soccer, meanwhile, would require the station to cut in the middle of the game (risking important plays, goals, etc.). The most advertising possible is a logo in a corner of the screen that will occasionally pop-up with the company's slogan over the audio of the announcers and overloading the half-time show with commercials (which is not at a high premium since that is when the audience drop-off is steepest). Thus, it's not just the factor of audience; with other sports like golf, football, baseball, etc. that draw big audiences and offer ample room for advertisements, TV stations have zero interest in promoting soccer (I would argue it's against their interest to see it thrive by the logic I offered). For the record: I love my futbol.
Beckham's declining pace makes him perfect for MLS, which has the tempo of the Latin American game and the skillset of the Northern European game. The money being quoted is irrelevant in the long run. Trouble is, I don't think he adds what MLS needs in the long run, which is someone who'd make the move to coaching when it's time to hang up the boots. I personally think that England would be better off for international play if more of its players played in the Liga and Serie A Or if they played regularly in the Premier League. Thanks, Arse; thanks, Jose; thanks, Rafa.
Hey, Rafa plays Carragher, Gerrard and Crouch regularly and Jose Lampard and Terry :->> Back on topic, Capello says Beckham will not play again for RM, he cannot be trusted with such a big contract hanging on his mind. Could possibly lead to an early arrival, on loan?
Soccer, meanwhile, would require the station to cut in the middle of the game (risking important plays, goals, etc.). The most advertising possible is a logo in a corner of the screen that will occasionally pop-up with the company's slogan over the audio of the announcers and overloading the half-time show with commercials (which is not at a high premium since that is when the audience drop-off is steepest). Somehow, soccer/football survives all these "problems" in Europe and Asia and has a huge television following with many sponsors. I can't imagine that North American audiences LIKE the stop-and-go commericals of North American football broadcasts. To me, nothing kills my interest in a game more than the following: Team A calls a timeout! 1 minute of commercials! Team A scores a touchdown! (17 seconds of play) Team A kicks the extra point! (5 seconds of play, proceded by 20 seconds of setting up) 2 minutes of commercials! Team A kicks off, Team B runs it back for a bit. (15-20 seconds of play) 1 minute of commercials! Nothing drives me up the wall more than 3 mintues of commercials bracketing 20 seconds of play.
Nothing drives me up the wall more than 3 mintues of commercials bracketing 20 seconds of play. This is one of the key points in the debate over actual playing time in the NFL.
Jose also plays Ashley Cole regularly, Joe Cole when he is healthy. He plays Wayne Bridge plays when Ashley Cole is rested (both play the same spot). Arsene is another story- he wants to be the anti-English and get it done with no Brits, which is not working well this season. I do not blame Capello for benching Beckham for the remainder. Not like he was playing much to begin with. Now he has his mind elsewhere. They are going to keep playing Reyes, since that is who they wanted long term anyway. Since MLS is not offering Real Madrid a transfer, I would highly doubt they just "let him go" to MLS early. They will let him rust on the bench until his contract is up.
grum: I am not making the argument that it's not viable (there is too much evidence to the contrary), but rather counterintuitive for soccer to become mainstream for the major networks in the United States. I simply believe that the returns on football, etc. would supersede those of soccer based on the greater amount of space available for advertising and the subsequent marketing versatility, etc. If there is an audience that is willing to accept 30 commercials in 30 minutes, why move to a substance that offers a fraction of that versatility?
Interesting link, Texan in NY. It amazes me that the people the scream the loudest that soccer is teh boring are invariably fans of American football. There is occasionally a fleeting moment or two of athleticism in each contest, nevertheless I cannot imagine a more tedious and dull pursuit than sitting down for 4 (!!!) hours and watching an NFL game. It's more of an advertising vehicle than a competition. To each his own, I guess.
The commercial problem for US networks is that round-football has predictable commercial breaks. The standard ITV approach is to have about eight minutes of half-time commercials and seven of analysis. (When ESPN did the World Cup, it was about 12-3.) What do people do? Put the kettle on, get another beer. Hence the Champions League's prime sponsors. Right now, live sport is one of the few TiVo-proof things on television. Unpredictable commercials that people have to sit through? Network exec gold. As for Becks, I'm just surprised that Capello isn't looking for a loan deal to get him out of the way till the end of the season. But he's vindictive enough of a bastard to have him training with the stiffs.
The stiffs that Beckham will be training with are better than most MLS teams. I would bet those "stiffs" could beat the Galaxy handily. Capello is a vindictive bastard though- touche'.
